Extra-aspect spells

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dunbruha
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Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Mon Jun 30, 2008 5:23 pm

I'm having trouble understanding the description of extra-aspect spells. What is the "normal range of Aspects"? Could you please explain the cost of the "lion's strike" spell? Thanks!

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by StormPatriarch » Tue Jul 01, 2008 5:23 am

dunbruha wrote:I'm having trouble understanding the description of extra-aspect spells. What is the "normal range of Aspects"? Could you please explain the cost of the "lion's strike" spell? Thanks!
I am not sure what the "Normal range of aspects" is so I can't help there but I will keep looking for the answer since now I am curious. The book does mention that harm spells effect 2 aspects (resilience and toughness) at no cost so I assume that this is within the "normal range of aspects". But how that applies over other non-harm extra aspect spells, I am not sure.

The lion strike spell cost looks like this to me in regards to a cost break down.

Player rolls 1d10, 1D8 (or whatever dice allow for the example numbers to occur). The results are a 10 and a 6 which equals 16. He drops the lowest die for his cost as per the SP cost rules which results in a cost of 10 but since lion strike is an extra aspect spell(it effects reflexes and unarmed harm) it costs 1.5x this number so the end cost would be 10 x 1.5 which equals 15.

I would guess that it should read something along the lines of "After dropping the lowest die, he is left with a cost of 10 SPs which you then multiply by 1.5 to arrive at a cost of 15 SPs".
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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:19 am

StormPatriarch wrote:Player rolls 1d10, 1D8 (or whatever dice allow for the example numbers to occur). The results are a 10 and a 6 which equals 16. He drops the lowest die for his cost as per the SP cost rules which results in a cost of 10 but since lion strike is an extra aspect spell(it effects reflexes and unarmed harm) it costs 1.5x this number so the end cost would be 10 x 1.5 which equals 15.
Yes, this makes sense, assuming only 2 dice were rolled...
StormPatriarch wrote:I would guess that it should read something along the lines of "After dropping the lowest die, he is left with a cost of 10 SPs which you then multiply by 1.5 to arrive at a cost of 15 SPs".
Definitely an improvement!

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:36 pm

StormPatriarch wrote:
dunbruha wrote:I'm having trouble understanding the description of extra-aspect spells. What is the "normal range of Aspects"? Could you please explain the cost of the "lion's strike" spell? Thanks!
The aspect of a spell describes what ability or subject is affected.
I am not sure what the "Normal range of aspects" is so I can't help there but I will keep looking for the answer since now I am curious. The book does mention that harm spells effect 2 aspects (resilience and toughness) at no cost so I assume that this is within the "normal range of aspects". But how that applies over other non-harm extra aspect spells, I am not sure.
The spell effect generally dictates the range of aspects. Like Harm is automatically two aspects, as you said. Augment is one, but the named aspect can differ (pick the one ability affected for each spell).

I'll pop back in to look at the cost ASAP...

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:58 pm

dancross wrote:The spell effect generally dictates the range of aspects. Like Harm is automatically two aspects, as you said. Augment is one, but the named aspect can differ (pick the one ability affected for each spell).
So (usually) a spell can incorporate at most 2 Aspects (the exception being spells dealing Harm, which could affect Resilience, then Toughness, plus one more)?

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by StormPatriarch » Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:22 am

dunbruha wrote:
StormPatriarch wrote:Player rolls 1d10, 1D8 (or whatever dice allow for the example numbers to occur). The results are a 10 and a 6 which equals 16. He drops the lowest die for his cost as per the SP cost rules which results in a cost of 10 but since lion strike is an extra aspect spell(it effects reflexes and unarmed harm) it costs 1.5x this number so the end cost would be 10 x 1.5 which equals 15.
Yes, this makes sense, assuming only 2 dice were rolled...
Well if more than 2 dice were rolled the wording would have to change again. Since the example states that the highest die left is a 10, that limits the example. Since you only drop the lowest, if 3 dice were rolled the highest would not be the only one to count towards SP cost. To expand to another example you could say the following as well:

PC has Arcanum d8>Mystic Study d6>Enhancements d4: Player rolls 6,4,2. Drop the lowest die (2) for a cost of 10 SPs (6+4). Multiply by 1.5 because lion strike is an extra aspect spell (effects unarmed harm and reflexes) and you get 15 SPs (10 x 1.5 = 15) as the cost again. :)
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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:51 am

StormPatriarch wrote:PC has Arcanum d8>Mystic Study d6>Enhancements d4: Player rolls 6,4,2. Drop the lowest die (2) for a cost of 10 SPs (6+4). Multiply by 1.5 because lion strike is an extra aspect spell (effects unarmed harm and reflexes) and you get 15 SPs (10 x 1.5 = 15) as the cost again. :)
This is helpful. I couldn't tell how many dice were rolled in the book example. (I was assuming 3, which had me confused...)

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:15 pm

dunbruha wrote:
StormPatriarch wrote:PC has Arcanum d8>Mystic Study d6>Enhancements d4: Player rolls 6,4,2. Drop the lowest die (2) for a cost of 10 SPs (6+4). Multiply by 1.5 because lion strike is an extra aspect spell (effects unarmed harm and reflexes) and you get 15 SPs (10 x 1.5 = 15) as the cost again. :)
This is helpful. I couldn't tell how many dice were rolled in the book example. (I was assuming 3, which had me confused...)
Would you please cite the page number of that example? I'll need to improve it...

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:49 pm

dancross wrote:
dunbruha wrote:
StormPatriarch wrote:PC has Arcanum d8>Mystic Study d6>Enhancements d4: Player rolls 6,4,2. Drop the lowest die (2) for a cost of 10 SPs (6+4). Multiply by 1.5 because lion strike is an extra aspect spell (effects unarmed harm and reflexes) and you get 15 SPs (10 x 1.5 = 15) as the cost again. :)
This is helpful. I couldn't tell how many dice were rolled in the book example. (I was assuming 3, which had me confused...)
Would you please cite the page number of that example? I'll need to improve it...
page 52

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:22 pm

Another note. The normal range of aspects is dictated by the Effect type. Augment and Curse have a larger list of possible aspects than Harm (possible range of only RS and toughness). An aspect can also be a sub-effect, like distract or stun (under Influence).

Here is an example

Spell Name: Concussive Blast (dual Effect)
Power Source: Primordial
School: Elementalism
Effect: Harm + Influence-stun.
Manifestation: Fire and Sonic Boom
Range: Area
Aspect: Resilience > Toughness / Stunning
Special: Any Harm exceeding the target's resilience results in a Stun Effect (see Influence). Cost = x 1.5
Do not apply the Potential-Harm twice. Roll the ADC, apply the result against Resilience, and if damage exceeds the RS of any target in area effect, the stunning takes hold. Creatures who take extra damage from fire take x2 damage.

Spell Name: Seize Mind (Dual Effect, plus extra Aspect).
Power Source: Psychogenic
School: Mentalist
Effect: Influence-Control Mind / Curse (Reflexes, Willpower).
Manifestation: psychgenic energy.
Range: One Creature
Aspect: Resilience > Toughness / Control Mind / Reflexes / Willpower
Special: Any Harm exceeding the target's resilience results in a maintainable Control Mind, plus negatives to the Reflexes and Willpower scores so long as the spell is maintained (see Influence). Cost = x 3

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:43 pm

dancross wrote:Another note. The normal range of aspects is dictated by the Effect type. Augment and Curse have a larger list of possible aspects than Harm (possible range of only RS and toughness). An aspect can also be a sub-effect, like distract or stun (under Influence).
OK, I get it. I guess I was thinking that "range" meant some numerical value. I can't think of a better word, though.

Nice spells, BTW. You should add them to the Tome of Knowledge.

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:48 pm

dunbruha wrote:
dancross wrote:Another note. The normal range of aspects is dictated by the Effect type. Augment and Curse have a larger list of possible aspects than Harm (possible range of only RS and toughness). An aspect can also be a sub-effect, like distract or stun (under Influence).
OK, I get it. I guess I was thinking that "range" meant some numerical value. I can't think of a better word, though.

Nice spells, BTW. You should add them to the Tome of Knowledge.
I wonder if anybody actually looks at that?

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:14 pm

dancross wrote:I wonder if anybody actually looks at that?
Well, they should!

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by orcface » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:33 pm

I am there every day, but there is no entry for spells.

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:41 pm

orcface wrote:I am there every day, but there is no entry for spells.
I don't know much about wikis. Can a Spells section be added?

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by orcface » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:52 pm

I am sure it can , but does the owner have to do it or can any user do it? I have no knowledge.

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:30 pm

orcface wrote:I am sure it can , but does the owner have to do it or can any user do it? I have no knowledge.
The wiki was created by the generous team of volunteers that designed the website. You should be able to create a user account and post whatever you wish. However, I am unable to create new categories on the main page. The person who set up the wiki may be able to show me how that's done.

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by StormPatriarch » Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:21 am

dancross wrote:Another note. The normal range of aspects is dictated by the Effect type. Augment and Curse have a larger list of possible aspects than Harm (possible range of only RS and toughness).
I guess this is the part I am having trouble with still. "Any effect that incorporates more aspects than is within its normal range costs x 1.5 in spell points with every casting." How do you know what the "normal range of aspects" is for each effect? I know that Harm spells have 2 aspects from the description and that Augment has 1 aspect according to your previous note in this thread.

Should it be that "Any spell that has more than 1 Aspect from its list of potential Aspects will cost 1.5x the SPs each time it is cast. Harm effect spells are the exception in that they effect resilience and than toughness at no additional cost."?
"I am the soul of honor, kindness, mercy, and goodness. Trust me in all things." Corwin to Dara, The Guns of Avalon

"...I was the lesser evil." --Bleys to Corwin, Nine Princes in Amber

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:36 am

StormPatriarch wrote:
dancross wrote:Another note. The normal range of aspects is dictated by the Effect type. Augment and Curse have a larger list of possible aspects than Harm (possible range of only RS and toughness).
I guess this is the part I am having trouble with still. "Any effect that incorporates more aspects than is within its normal range costs x 1.5 in spell points with every casting." How do you know what the "normal range of aspects" is for each effect? I know that Harm spells have 2 aspects from the description and that Augment has 1 aspect according to your previous note in this thread.

Should it be that "Any spell that has more than 1 Aspect from its list of potential Aspects will cost 1.5x the SPs each time it is cast. Harm effect spells are the exception in that they effect resilience and than toughness at no additional cost."?
Yes, that's how it should be stated, to make it clear. Another thing for my "to do" list. ;-)

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:38 am

orcface wrote:I am there every day, but there is no entry for spells.
That's fixed. Also there is a help file on how to edit the pages...

http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Contents

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dunbruha » Thu Jul 03, 2008 10:35 am

dancross wrote:
orcface wrote:I am there every day, but there is no entry for spells.
That's fixed. Also there is a help file on how to edit the pages...

http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Contents
I see the spells (cool!), but the help section is empty...

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Re: Extra-aspect spells

Post by dancross » Thu Jul 03, 2008 5:54 pm

dunbruha wrote:
dancross wrote:
orcface wrote:I am there every day, but there is no entry for spells.
That's fixed. Also there is a help file on how to edit the pages...

http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Contents
I see the spells (cool!), but the help section is empty...
I'm experimenting with Google "Sites" to see if there would be less of a learning curve.

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