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clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:29 am
by baophrat
Hi,

I'm just want to know how to do with "patron" spells when it's not a patron but a god. How create "gods spells" and is there the same process with failures ("gods taint") ??

Sorry for my english...

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:33 pm
by GnomeBoy
I would think the easiest thing to do would be to just create new spells as normal. All the Cleric spells are granted from gods, which is why they don't have "Patron Taint" associated with them.

Unless I don't understand your question...

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 4:09 am
by BanjoJohn
If I understand what you are asking, it is, "how do you create a system similar to Patrons and their spells for Wizards, except it is Gods and their spells for Clerics"

Technically, all of the spells a Cleric gets to use are gifted by their god already. There are some good examples in the "DCC Annual" of expanded entries on Gods and bonuses that Clerics get from being an acolyte of that god.

In general, if you were wanting to make Clerics as different and varied as Wizards can be because of Patrons, I would try and work out these few steps.

"Do clerics of this god have different 'titles' at each level compared to the generic cleric entry in the book?"
"Do aspects of this god make the default cleric spells "lay on hands" or "turn unholy" act any differently than normal?"
"Are there specific kinds of "Divine aid" that the god would provide that make it different than other gods?"
"What kinds of sacrifices would this god accept? Does the god give different favors for different kinds of sacrifices?"
"Are there different weapon training/proficiency for followers of this god than in the book?"
"What kinds of disapproval would this god have that are different from in the book?"

And then, there are usually some kind of bonus features or spells that the cleric gets at level 1, level 3, and level 5. These features or spells are exclusive to clerics of that god.

So that can be a lot of work, but it can help flesh out your world a lot too if you ever wanted to have bad guys who are clerics or have clerics in their group to make them stand out.

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 5:13 am
by Jim Skach
I'm thinking he's asking something else...and maybe I'm wrong but...

Patrons have specific spells they can gift their minions. See: Kith of the Hydra for Azi Dahaka.
Gods can also be patrons. See: Wizard, Supernatural Patron (pg 48): "Demons and devils...elder gods...whisper secrets in exchange for favors best left unexplained"
Therefore: If a patron is also a god (or a god is also a patron), how does one do patron spells? Is it just some of the existing Cleric spells?

If that is the question, my answer is....

If the Patron is a god...it does not matter. Unless the relationship between character and entity (god, patron, whatever) is a Divine relationship (a cleric worshiping a god), then treat that relationship exactly as a patron relationship - specific spells, taint, invoke, etc.

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 9:51 pm
by baophrat
Thanks you all !

Indeed it was not clear my question but your answers are ! So I have got enough informations to clarify my game's use.

[I should take english lessons...]

Nice day

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:01 pm
by baophrat
So...

In the case of a deity being both a patron and a god, the cleric who benefits from the patron spells can thus lose his spells just like a wizard ?

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 3:26 pm
by GnomeBoy
baophrat wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:01 pm
So...

In the case of a deity being both a patron and a god, the cleric who benefits from the patron spells can thus lose his spells just like a wizard ?
They would use spells as they normally do. They don't lose the spell, but their fumble range would go up, increasing the chance of disapproval.

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Sun Jan 12, 2020 6:45 am
by baophrat
Okay, got it.

Re: clerics and patrons & clerics and gods

Posted: Sun Jan 12, 2020 7:03 am
by Jim Skach
I would also say that if you're dealing with a cleric, that patron aspect of a god is essentially irrelevant. Ignore it.