A question of Magic at 0 level

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OttawaTom
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A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by OttawaTom »

As a potential funnel Judge, I had a question about potential magic using characters in a character funnel. Am I right that until a character gets to first level and learns spells they can't cast magic in a funnel? Otherwise, is there a way to improvise magic at 0 level, like cobble together an improvise patron from your black grimoire, Spellburn like crazy and then trust to your luck?

What's the RAW answer?
NJPDX
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by NJPDX »

You don't have a class until you reach first level. You're a turnip farmer, a squire, an ostler, a miner ... That's it. If people want muck about with spell scrolls and grimoires untrained (1d10 for a spell check) then by all means let them try ...
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Zargon
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by Zargon »

I typically wouldn't allow a player to cast spells at 0 level. Characters have their occupational skills, trade tools, and random equipment to rely on, but do not possess a class. If there was an exception to this rule I should think it might revolve around an item, such as an arcane scroll, talisman of lore, or a wizard staff that fate (or worse) may lay along the path of destiny & doom.
In such a case the spell casting would transmit through the device like a live wire, which by way of ‘happenstance’ rests in the grasp of a hapless peasant or some such philistine, ignorant to the sudden bidding price of his very soul, and the watchers from the world just beyond who usher forth curses that claim and damn; effusing arcane manifestations the beguiled wanderer believes to be performances of his own...
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OttawaTom
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by OttawaTom »

Zargon wrote:I typically wouldn't allow a player to cast spells at 0 level. Characters have their occupational skills, trade tools, and random equipment to rely on, but do not possess a class. If there was an exception to this rule I should think it might revolve around an item, such as an arcane scroll, talisman of lore, or a wizard staff that fate (or worse) may lay along the path of destiny & doom.
In such a case the spell casting would transmit through the device like a live wire, which by way of ‘happenstance’ rests in the grasp of a hapless peasant or some such philistine, ignorant to the sudden bidding price of his very soul, and the watchers from the world just beyond who usher forth curses that claim and damn; effusing arcane manifestations the beguiled wanderer believes to be performances of his own...
Well that's kind of my thinking in allowing it, the neophytes do have implements what with the apprentice having a book of spells and the beadle a holy symbol. All they need is the iron will to grasp the nettle, embrace the pain, and seek their destiny.

And corruption, lots of corruption.
aesdana
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by aesdana »

As 0-level PCs are not skilled in magic, they roll a d10 to use magic.

If their starting occupation says they're skilled, they roll a d20 but still can't cast a spell like a normal wizard (just by reading a scroll or activating a special feature in the scenario or whatever happens in your funnel).

And if they're "in-between", they roll a d10+2 (read the chapter on skills).

So, yes, they can do it in special circumstances.

I would add that DCC rpg is typically the "yes-with-a-price" rpg : all those fumble/corruption" tables are here for a purpose !
NJPDX
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by NJPDX »

If you feel like you want to introduce spell scrolls and the like to 0-level play then by all means follow your muse. Bear in mind that your players will probably identify one or two of their peons as cannon fodder pretty early on and I'd be a little wary of people trying to game the system; sacrificing some character they probably didn't want to play long term any way.

By rule, I would disallow spellburn (even thieves "trained" to read a magic scroll can't do that) and more than corruption I'd probably focus on AoE misfires for fumbled spellchecks.

Any 0-level scrub audacious enough to fool around with eldritch powers probably deserves a bad end ... even for an apprentice (watch the animated movie Fantasia for reference).
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Weisenwolf
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by Weisenwolf »

What do we assume is in the wizard's apprentice's grimoire?
NJPDX
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by NJPDX »

Weisenwolf wrote:What do we assume is in the wizard's apprentice's grimoire?
Nothing. To me it's a blank receptacle. Probably a very nicely bound book, with parchment suitable for scribing spells, but definitely not a "loaded gun."
OttawaTom
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by OttawaTom »

Well I ran a session on Saturday past, using Sailors on the Starless Sea. My three friends were happily searching the ruins and getting increasingly more creeped out by my discriptions of chaos' stronghold. Exactly like I thought, my friends after fooling around with the well and some rolling on the corruption table, the party encountered the beastmen in the tower and the wizard's apprentice decided to manipulate raw magic. Because of that strange well granting a +10 to the check he grasped the live wire and rolling a three on a d10 created a light effect that he described that limned the Beastman Lord allowing the hunter to fire at will.

He also caught a lot of corruption on that casting, though his twisted form didn't last long as the champion decided that he was the one to die next. All-in-all it was a neat exchange, and I think I want to make an untrained magic table for my use...
OttawaTom
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by OttawaTom »

NJPDX wrote:
Weisenwolf wrote:What do we assume is in the wizard's apprentice's grimoire?
Nothing. To me it's a blank receptacle. Probably a very nicely bound book, with parchment suitable for scribing spells, but definitely not a "loaded gun."
I can see the reasoning behind that, but I can't agree with it. To my mind, wizards and the like in DCC are a raspacious lot. They have been hiding whatever magic they can find from their masters, and that knowledge no matter how incomplete calls to them. Like the One Ring or the Dark side it wants to be used by the wizards as the powers behind the magic want to encompass and pervade the world that the PCs in. They want to give in and feel the rush, "Get thee behind me reality, I AM YOUR MASTER!" I also like magic depicted as a corrosive force and teaching this object lesson to the plauyers early on before they become a full wizard is dramatic and fun.

And it's nothing so useful as a loaded gun, as being a semi-loaded gun with a bullet in the chamber, a quickly spun cylinder, and the wizard not knowing which head it's pointed towards!
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Zargon
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by Zargon »

Hear, Hear!
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NJPDX
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Re: A question of Magic at 0 level

Post by NJPDX »

OttawaTom wrote: I can see the reasoning behind that, but I can't agree with it. To my mind, wizards and the like in DCC are a raspacious lot. They have been hiding whatever magic they can find from their masters, and that knowledge no matter how incomplete calls to them. Like the One Ring or the Dark side it wants to be used by the wizards as the powers behind the magic want to encompass and pervade the world that the PCs in. They want to give in and feel the rush, "Get thee behind me reality, I AM YOUR MASTER!" I also like magic depicted as a corrosive force and teaching this object lesson to the plauyers early on before they become a full wizard is dramatic and fun.

And it's nothing so useful as a loaded gun, as being a semi-loaded gun with a bullet in the chamber, a quickly spun cylinder, and the wizard not knowing which head it's pointed towards!
Awesome. There is nothing to agree with or disagree with, it's your game and you should put whatever you want in it. Somebody asked what we thought was in "it" and I gave my answer ... which is not the definitive last word on what should be in other people's campaigns.

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