5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
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5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
Seriously, I aint lyin...
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- Far-Sighted Wanderer
- Posts: 16
- Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 2:25 pm
Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
I'll disagree with you, and I'll even do it without having to talk about why game balance is unimportant in DCC.
First, you're comparing apples and oranges. A wizard can use Lokerimon's Unerring Hunter to exterminate an enemy without having to get his hands dirty, and with no collateral damage. A cleric, on the other hand, has to rely on Righteous Fire or Weather Control, which are both much less subtle. I understand why you would be impressed by die codes like 10d20+40, and I'm sure that these spells would do an equally impressive job of destroying treasures and innocent lives within the blast radius.
Second, although a Cleric can get some truly astounding spell results for rolling a ridiculous number like 38, the only practical way to get those results is by burning lots and lots of luck. Clerics can't spellburn, so their spells are by default handicapped.
Third, if you still don't like it... change it. There's a reason we get 20+ wizard spells for levels 1 through 3, them way less for levels 4 and 5. The book assumes a judge will create additional spells as become necessary for his game. If your 9th level wizard wants to be able to cast Atom Bomb, he should be able to... as long as he's willing to quest for it.
First, you're comparing apples and oranges. A wizard can use Lokerimon's Unerring Hunter to exterminate an enemy without having to get his hands dirty, and with no collateral damage. A cleric, on the other hand, has to rely on Righteous Fire or Weather Control, which are both much less subtle. I understand why you would be impressed by die codes like 10d20+40, and I'm sure that these spells would do an equally impressive job of destroying treasures and innocent lives within the blast radius.
Second, although a Cleric can get some truly astounding spell results for rolling a ridiculous number like 38, the only practical way to get those results is by burning lots and lots of luck. Clerics can't spellburn, so their spells are by default handicapped.
Third, if you still don't like it... change it. There's a reason we get 20+ wizard spells for levels 1 through 3, them way less for levels 4 and 5. The book assumes a judge will create additional spells as become necessary for his game. If your 9th level wizard wants to be able to cast Atom Bomb, he should be able to... as long as he's willing to quest for it.
Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
The ability to level an entire city > a secret magic assassin.
Great game. But I hold these truths to be self evident.
Yeah, I know, and I probably will add spells. Everyone should.
But C5 > W5. So it needs some afixin...thats all.
Great game. But I hold these truths to be self evident.
Yeah, I know, and I probably will add spells. Everyone should.
But C5 > W5. So it needs some afixin...thats all.
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- Far-Sighted Wanderer
- Posts: 16
- Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 2:25 pm
Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
What is 'self evident' about that? Righteous Fire can't touch an enemy who is a thousand miles away, but an Unerring Hunter can. Righteous Fire always risks collateral damage, but Unerring Hunter never does. Heck, if the caster isn't careful, he could even wind up incinerating himself with RF, and there's no such risk with UH.atlascott wrote:The ability to level an entire city > a secret magic assassin.
Great game. But I hold these truths to be self evident.
This is like saying a hand grenade is a better weapon than an assault rifle just because the grenade does more damage. There are a lot of other factors to consider.
Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
I guess I'm confused. Why does that matter? Do you think Wizard spells should be more powerful? Why? We're talking about level nine characters here. Extreme epic. This is going to be like an ancient warlock and the highest of high priests.atlascott wrote: But C5 > W5. So it needs some afixin...thats all.
- finarvyn
- Cold-Hearted Immortal
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Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
And level 9 characters are somewhat equivalent to level 18 in D&D. Those characters tend to be able to pack a real punch.jozxyqk wrote:I guess I'm confused. Why does that matter? Do you think Wizard spells should be more powerful? Why? We're talking about level nine characters here. Extreme epic. This is going to be like an ancient warlock and the highest of high priests.atlascott wrote: But C5 > W5. So it needs some afixin...thats all.
My solution is to slow the levelling process. If you don't want characters to access that degree of power, don't let them advance so quickly. In order to reach 9th level by the book, you need 890 XP which translates into surviving over 220 "difficult" encounters. That's a lot of experience, and by that point maybe characters should be able to level cities.
Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
Re: 5th level cleric spells > wizard spells
Wizards can hit the top end of their spells with a little spell burn, which clerics don't have access to, except in rare situations.atlascott wrote:The ability to level an entire city > a secret magic assassin.
Great game. But I hold these truths to be self evident.
Yeah, I know, and I probably will add spells. Everyone should.
But C5 > W5. So it needs some afixin...thats all.