2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

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Ze Groupe
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2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Ze Groupe » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:38 am

Hi all,

Note: I work in hospitality...i manage bars, and i game with others who work in bars, so we play at odd times, hence the reason we have been able to play 2 sessions in 2 days that aren't a weekend.

Disclaimer: We tend to drink when we play as it is usually our day(s) off when we get together. ;)

So yesterday at 2pm UK time, and then again today at 3pm, we played 2 "follow on" 0 level sessions, and here are my comments.

1. 0 level funneling is great fun. Period.

2. I applied the -4 for no weapon training in session 1 and it sucked, in session 2 i didn't, and it was better. So i'll eat my words on that, though i (and the other 4 players if i may say so) still say that there must be a better way of doing it other than removing a rule that is then reintroduced a session later.

3. The Crit tables need to be a bit more generic. There were at least 5 occasions in the 2 sessions where the Crit table made no sense at all with the narrative. Yeh i winged it, but if i'm going to wing it all the time then why bother having to look stuff up?

4. There seems to be a lot of overlap in the rules. By this i mean, Agility tests, reflex saves, and such. Most of the players stated that the 2-3 terms that were often being used for tasks could probably be done with 1 term. Does that make sense?

5. The general consensus was "If you are going to use funky dice (not that we did except for character gen) in a system, then make the maximum use of them possible!". This was in reference to -4, vs d16's etc.

6. Dual wielding halflings are great idea! (Not that we got to use it/them, but we all agreed it was cool)

7. Of the 12 0 lvl characters only 5 survived, 1 of which had an average stat of 8! :oops:

I have other thoughts, and will get back to you, but right now im off to cook dinner. If anyone has any particular questions of us, please feel free to ask.

Cheers.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Ravenheart87 » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:44 am

Ze Groupe wrote: 3. The Crit tables need to be a bit more generic. There were at least 5 occasions in the 2 sessions where the Crit table made no sense at all with the narrative. Yeh i winged it, but if i'm going to wing it all the time then why bother having to look stuff up?
Cheers.
I completely agree with this. In case of some monsters, the critical hits give totally impossible result. Also, maybe I missed it, but I can't find what critical tables monsters use, when they are attacking PCs.
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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Ze Groupe » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:50 am

Ravenheart87 wrote:
Ze Groupe wrote: 3. The Crit tables need to be a bit more generic. There were at least 5 occasions in the 2 sessions where the Crit table made no sense at all with the narrative. Yeh i winged it, but if i'm going to wing it all the time then why bother having to look stuff up?
Cheers.
I completely agree with this. In case of some monsters, the critical hits give totally impossible result. Also, maybe I missed it, but I can't find what critical tables monsters use, when they are attacking PCs.
I just used the 0 lvl table for my baddies as they were facing stinky goblins!! :wink:

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by jmucchiello » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:58 am

Ze Groupe wrote:2. I applied the -4 for no weapon training in session 1 and it sucked, in session 2 i didn't, and it was better. So i'll eat my words on that, though i (and the other 4 players if i may say so) still say that there must be a better way of doing it other than removing a rule that is then reintroduced a session later.
Try -2 next time :)

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Ze Groupe » Thu Jun 09, 2011 11:09 am

-2 probably would have been ok actually....oh well they are all dead..dead...dead! Now! :twisted:

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by talmor » Thu Jun 09, 2011 11:38 am

YAY to actual play test reports!

Can you tell us a little bit more about the adventure/session?

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Ze Groupe » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:09 pm

Of course!

Basically i had 4 players, all of which rolled 3 0 lvl's by the book. I would list them ALL here, but truth be told i can't remember them all. I do however remember the surviving 5.

1. A Halfling Trader (who turned out to be deadly with his short sword!)
2. An Elven Forester
3. A Gravedigger (Shovels are deadly i tell you!)
4. An Urchin (Agility saved the day!)
5. Dwarven Blacksmith

Basically i grabbed my Dungeons of Doom book, picked a section of a map, and went with it.

The sessions included 12 rooms, 17 goblin adversaries, 2 pit traps, and a room of deadly gas.

I don't think players used Luck enough, though i got the impression this was based on "if this guy/gal makes it to lvl 1, i want him to have all the luck he can have. After the game we all discussed the idea of Luck resetting when lvl 0's hit lvl 1, which i personally think would be a good idea.

Combats went very quickly, however lvl 0's don't really use any of the advanced options, so this doesn't really say much.

We used Index cards for each character which was fast and easy, as we kind of used them to represent the battlefield too.

All in all, good fun.

Again, if you have any specifics, just ask.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by talmor » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:18 pm

Ze Groupe wrote:We used Index cards for each character which was fast and easy, as we kind of used them to represent the battlefield too.

...

Again, if you have any specifics, just ask.
Was the index card used as a character sheet, or did you have a "cheat sheet" of rules?

How familair were the players with DCC before you began playing?

Your comment about luck makes sense--even if a player wants to go thief with a character, why "burn" your luck at level 0, but then again, shouldn't level 0 characters rely MORE on luck than level 1 adventurers?

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by QuentinTheTroll » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:30 pm

talmor wrote:
Ze Groupe wrote:We used Index cards for each character which was fast and easy, as we kind of used them to represent the battlefield too.

...

Again, if you have any specifics, just ask.
Was the index card used as a character sheet, or did you have a "cheat sheet" of rules?

How familair were the players with DCC before you began playing?

Your comment about luck makes sense--even if a player wants to go thief with a character, why "burn" your luck at level 0, but then again, shouldn't level 0 characters rely MORE on luck than level 1 adventurers?
Haven't played yet, but my first thought was the opposite. Since you don't get your class until level 1, it makes sense for at least one of your characters to burn through luck like it was going out of style, just to survive.

I think it would be extra funny that the character who "presses his luck" and gets an early reputation for being "extra lucky" is going to have to live on that reputation (and not feats of luck) for a long, long time.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Hamel™ » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:02 pm

I've run too my first DCC game with my group (5 people, shifting DM between game sessions), starting with a L0 character funnel.

I've talked them about DCC RPG since early February, and at first I've received some skeptical comments (luckily they changed their minds in the last months because I've kept on giving them more details about the game, so that they started reading about this game on their own).

BTW, we gathered around the table with the usual survival kit (cigs, booze, chips) and they started creating their own cannon fodder.. ehm, characters.
Just a few minutes to remember them the general rules, and each player created 3 PCs. Here's the group:

Player A: Halfling Gipsy, Farmer and Dwarven Blacksmith
Player B: Indentured Servant and 2 Elvish Artisans
Player C: Guild Beggar, Herder and Healer
Player D: Grave Digger, Dwarven Blacksmith and Caravan Guard

They all started in Spoonstone, an isolated rural village located in a valley far about 20 miles from the closest city, surrounded for 1/4 by a small river and for 3/4 by woods.
Only 3 roads connect Spoonstone with the rest of known world: the river itself (navigable with small ships), a path running parallel to the river and a path in the woods ending in a narrow mountain pass (try to guess where they're going to walk).

After character creation, they decided briefly the various relationships: Elvish Artisans (M/F twins) came to Spoonstone on the same caravan protected by the Caravan Guard along with the Halfling Gypsy, Farmer and Herder (Khain and Abel.. whoopie!) are young brothers, Blacksmiths are father and son, the Servant (group's traitor) was the Healer's assistant, Grave Digger and Beggar had no particular relationships.

The village had no particular defenses, just a couple of outposts at the sides of the village occupied by about a dozen people (city guards and foresters).

That's what happened:
- the Servant has met a group of goblin scouts the day before, and his life has been spared in exchange of his betrayal
- the Servant has put too sleep the guards on the woodside outpost (mixing herbs in their beers) and then he ran to the port
- after the sunset, he slipped away from Healer's house heading to the city port, only to see ships sinking thanks to a 4-5 goblins who crossed the river
- about 50 goblins arrived from the woodside, killing people in their houses and burning buildings
- the Beggar gives the alarm (killing an unlucky goblin with a lucky slingshot!!), and people starts running around
- all PCs (plus hen and dog) avoided a volley of arrows (damned d20!!) and headed to the mountain side, Servant was already there on a cart full of hay
- PCs followed the path to the Mountain Pass, chased by a small group of goblins (Farmer killed by an arrow)
- PCs reached the entrance to the Mountain Pass, Dwarven Daddy set the hay on fire with his flintstone and pushed it down the slope
- the flaming cart killed 4 goblins, group's shooters (Gypsy and Beggar) hit a couple of lucky shots
- PCs ran in formation, people with higher HPs at the extreme, weaklings in the middle
- hearing goblin voices coming from distance, PCs decided to set a trap for them
- PCs put some clothes around a couple of small rocks, Elves used their clay to made faces, Beggar's crutches used to simulate weapons
- Luck Check succeded by Player B (the plan's master) to cheat the incoming goblins
- Strength Check (to push rocks over the goblins) succeeded by Dwarven Son and failed by Dwarven Daddy
- Caravan Guard and Dwarven Daddy got killed, Herder pushed the rocks Dwarven Daddy couldn't and blocked the path, killing the other goblings
- no more voices, Grave Digger buried their deceased fellows
- group kept on walking, camped and got attacked by a pack of wandering wolves, Healer killed, Herder's dog rocks
- second day, group reaches a fork: 5 choose right, 3 choose left
- 3 out of 5 PCs fail a Luck Check about their choice: they're gonna regret it soon
- right path heads into a cave, they go in and easily beat a group of bats
- underground lake, they wake up a light green glowing giant toad with slimy tentacles
- gorgeous fight: Herder hits a Crit with Caravan Guard's short sword (cutting a monster's tentacle with a 7 on the table), Gyspy hits a funny 0 on Crit, Graved Digger after a fumble, Beggar dies a round after he used his oil flask against the monster, Dwarf hits the deadly strike
- adventure ends with only 6+2 survivors: Halfling Gypsy, Dwarf, Elf, Elf, Herder, Servant, dog, hen


Comments
1 - Generally speaking, morale was pretty high during the entire game.
2 - We agreed about having too many Crit Tables (better having just 2, one for creatures with limbs and the other for limbless creatures)
3 - We all loved the "You can do only what you can do" philosophy behind Skills
4 - No character was too weak or too strong
5 - At the hand of the game hen, dog, halfling and dwarf paid a tribute to Town Musicians of Bremen :mrgreen:
6 - We tried Luck Burn a couple of times (going heavy, at least 4 points burned), and it was fun too
7 - very eager to turn PCs into L1 characters

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by finarvyn » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:54 am

Ze Groupe wrote:There seems to be a lot of overlap in the rules. By this i mean, Agility tests, reflex saves, and such. Most of the players stated that the 2-3 terms that were often being used for tasks could probably be done with 1 term. Does that make sense?
Sort of, but keep in mind that agility tests are usually done when you are trying to accomplish something, while reflex saves are done when someone is trying to do something to you.

Different situations, but I agree that they are similar mechanics put together. A single number could do both, but then that one number becomes a lot more powerful and easier to powergame.
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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Alaxk » Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:41 am

Wow, I loved these play reports. Keep them coming :D
Restoring Luck at level 1 is an interesting idea.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by QuentinTheTroll » Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:54 am

Hamel™ wrote:I've run too my first DCC game with my group (5 people, shifting DM between game sessions), starting with a L0 character funnel.

- adventure ends with only 6+2 survivors: Halfling Gypsy, Dwarf, Elf, Elf, Herder, Servant, dog, hen
Elf twins for the win - correct me if I'm reading it wrong, but did they survive this because they avoided a lot of danger? I'd be curious to see their XP relative to the other survivors.

Cowardice has its privileges, after all. If that's the case, I think that is one of the more elegant possible results of funnelling - the characters that survive aren't necessarily the characters you would choose, yet their stories are richer because of it.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Hamel™ » Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:51 am

QuentinTheTroll wrote:Elf twins for the win - correct me if I'm reading it wrong, but did they survive this because they avoided a lot of danger? I'd be curious to see their XP relative to the other survivors.
Elves scored some kills and avoided different hits thanks to a bite and flee strategy while battling with goblins: having no Attack of Opportunity helps a lot here.

That player is just a very smart guy, with an outrageous luck (in [3.X] his wizard frequently survived high level Sneak Attacks thanks to flurries of 1 and 2 with D6).

We honestly hate him.
We've promised Arioch his soul since a looooong time. :evil:

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Melkor » Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:57 am

Ze Groupe wrote:
2. I applied the -4 for no weapon training in session 1 and it sucked, in session 2 i didn't, and it was better. So i'll eat my words on that, though i (and the other 4 players if i may say so) still say that there must be a better way of doing it other than removing a rule that is then reintroduced a session later.


5. The general consensus was "If you are going to use funky dice (not that we did except for character gen) in a system, then make the maximum use of them possible!". This was in reference to -4, vs d16's etc.
I completely agree with these points. Thanks!
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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by jmucchiello » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:00 am

Hamel™ wrote:Elves scored some kills and avoided different hits thanks to a bite and flee strategy while battling with goblins: having no Attack of Opportunity helps a lot here.
Did you use the Withdrawal rules?
Page 80 wrote:WITHDRAWAL
Once a character is engaged in melee, he cannot back away without opening himself up to attack. If a character or monster withdraws from an active melee – whether to retreat, move to a new position, or attempt some action – its combat opponents immediately receive a single free attack.

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by QuentinTheTroll » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:01 am

Hamel™ wrote:
QuentinTheTroll wrote:Elf twins for the win - correct me if I'm reading it wrong, but did they survive this because they avoided a lot of danger? I'd be curious to see their XP relative to the other survivors.
Elves scored some kills and avoided different hits thanks to a bite and flee strategy while battling with goblins: having no Attack of Opportunity helps a lot here.

That player is just a very smart guy, with an outrageous luck (in [3.X] his wizard frequently survived high level Sneak Attacks thanks to flurries of 1 and 2 with D6).

We honestly hate him.
We've promised Arioch his soul since a looooong time. :evil:
Ha! I didn't even notice that none of Player B's PC's died, and that his survivors constituted half the "winners."

Who dug the Grave Digger's grave?

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Hamel™ » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:36 pm

jmucchiello wrote:Did you use the Withdrawal rules?
D'oh, it seems we neglected that rule (it was just a L0 test, so we weren't so committed).
QuentinTheTroll wrote:Who dug the Grave Digger's grave?
Squeezed by monster's tentacle, after he fell prone with a Fumble.
That's why nobody thought about burying him. :mrgreen:

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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by goodmangames » Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:41 pm

I'm really enjoying reading the playtest reports. Keep 'em coming!

Good point on "if you're gonna use weird dice, use a lot of them." I might be able to work with those. :)
Hamel™ wrote:- PCs put some clothes around a couple of small rocks, Elves used their clay to made faces, Beggar's crutches used to simulate weapons
Love the use of the 0-level trade goods!
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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by geordie racer » Sun Jun 12, 2011 3:51 am

We played through an XRP module 'Legacy of Darkness' with four 5th Level wizards last night. The DM made us roll 1d5 to see how many Corruption rolls we start with. Then a straight d20 roll to see what type of Corruption.

I rolled Corpulence and Demonic Taint (Goat Legs). One of the other guys rolled Consumption (the description needs attention - a month is too long, making little difference in module play), another had Sticky-up Hair, another had thick-bear like fur and a face in his back.

I had a concept of making my wizard subtle (well, for an obese goat-legged dude) using cantrips and Ventriloquism whenever possible, nothing too showy. My mercurial magic effect for Cantrip was Gibbering Allies (I was hoping for Mentalism), for Ventriloquism I rolled strange growths appearing . So, I stuck to my concept, my character acting as if nothing was happening - except for in the dungeon where we went spellburn crazy and brought the whole place down on the half-elf necromancer during a very confused spell-duel. Much fun :)

5th level - we all agreed that the wizards seemed competent, though we still lost a few spells. With only using 1st Level spells we weren't flying around or being invisible assassins but the characters seemed pretty powerful when we spellburnt two spells each in a single round, and when 2 casters each managed to cast a magic missile in the 24-27 range, so each doing 4d12+5 damage.
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Re: 2 x 0 Lvl Sessions. Comments.

Post by Harley Stroh » Mon Jun 13, 2011 7:22 am

Sliding this over to the bright and shiny Actual Play forum.

//H
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