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 Post subject: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:37 pm 
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I completed a playtest today and let's just say that Orcs are brutal against level 0 opponents (love it!).

Of note was that after reaching level 1 the warrior got to pick a weapon that he was "lucky" with. This character had found a longsword on an orc and wanted to make that his weapon but as he currently had a negative luck modifier was reluctant and considered picking the Sap since he had no intention of using them. After awarding luck due to the completion of the adventure he was brought back to a +0 so he uneasily chose the Longsword but if he has to burn luck in the next adventure does he sheathe his sword and draw a shortsword? That seems like an odd mechanic at that point.

Since this is his "lucky weapon" should this not simply made +1 (like a similar post regarding Birth Augurs)? Perhaps it is permanently +1, or at least can never go below 0 (it is afterall "lucky"). To have it go in to negatives seems silly.


Last edited by bholmes4 on Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:21 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:51 pm 
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What the heck, I'll repeat my call for a constant +1 to all character's Luck modifier. That would mean that the average person actually gets benefit from what they are lucky at.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 4:40 am 
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Not a bad idea, overall. Luck, in particular, is one of those stats which is really not fun to start with a negative bonus. I think that having characters be klutzy or uncoordinated can be okay, not-too-swift thinking can be tolerated, abrasive personality is fine, and so on, but when luck starts off negative you have some issues in play. As has been suggested, the automatic +1 in your lucky Birth Augur is a good idea. Extending this to a lucky weapon is nice as well.

Another couple ideas:

1. Since rolls are done in order anyway, the luck roll could get one re-roll upon charcter generation.

2. There could be a rule that any starting luck of 3-8 would automatically start at luck 9 in order to mandate a non-negative modifier at the start of the game.

I don't think that either would upset the game balance significantly.

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:49 am 
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I dislike the steady powercreep of stackable +1 modifiers and prefer that a warrior's lucky weapon just ignores all negative Luck modifiers.

Using this method the lucky weapon is a greater boon to Low-luck characters or those whose Luck fluctuates to low levels due to burning it. Charcters who always keep their Luck high don't receive any extra benefit from the weapon, they're lucky enough anyway :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:19 am 
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geordie racer wrote:
I dislike the steady powercreep of stackable +1 modifiers and prefer that a warrior's lucky weapon just ignores all negative Luck modifiers.

Using this method the lucky weapon is a greater boon to Low-luck characters or those whose Luck fluctuates to low levels due to burning it. Charcters who always keep their Luck high don't receive any extra benefit from the weapon, they're lucky enough anyway :wink:


This works for me as well, I just don't like the negative modifier as it encourages players to actually put that weapon away. It's silly.

The only reason I might suggest +1 is that it's "quicker and easier" to keep it constant. Teally, it's not a big deal though as by this point you will likely only have 1 character to keep track of.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 12:51 pm 
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geordie racer wrote:
I dislike the steady powercreep of stackable +1 modifiers and prefer that a warrior's lucky weapon just ignores all negative Luck modifiers.


I just want a unified rule. How about:

"Lucky X ignores all negative Luck modifiers on action X."

That is, if a character is specifically lucky at something they get a bonus when their luck is high, and never get a luck penalty against it. I think right now this includes Birth Augur, Class Luck, Crits and Fumbles by the character.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:34 pm 
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meinvt wrote:
I just want a unified rule. How about:

"Lucky X ignores all negative Luck modifiers on action X."

That is, if a character is specifically lucky at something they get a bonus when their luck is high, and never get a luck penalty against it. I think right now this includes Birth Augur, Class Luck, Crits and Fumbles by the character.

I like this. I wouldn't want to eliminate all luck penalties, because it's fun for some characters to be unlucky. But the augury and class abilities that add Luck to something shouldn't give a penalty IMO.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:16 pm 
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Atlatl Jones wrote:
meinvt wrote:
I just want a unified rule. How about:

"Lucky X ignores all negative Luck modifiers on action X."

That is, if a character is specifically lucky at something they get a bonus when their luck is high, and never get a luck penalty against it. I think right now this includes Birth Augur, Class Luck, Crits and Fumbles by the character.

I like this. I wouldn't want to eliminate all luck penalties, because it's fun for some characters to be unlucky. But the augury and class abilities that add Luck to something shouldn't give a penalty IMO.


You said what I meant. Crits and Fumbles should not have been on my list. "Lucky" Augurs and Class features should be bonus only, everything else should go up and down as normal. I'd be okay with allowing Augurs to go negative, although some names should reflect both options, but having Class Features go negative becomes a problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:44 pm 
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I kind of like Birth Augurs going negative as well but I don't like that positive birth augurs can swing to negative and vice versa.

I say a negative starting birth augur can only be increased to a 0, a positive can only be decreased to 0. Basically you were either born unlucky in an area or lucky. Through your actions you can swing the fates so that you are no longer affected by an unlucky modifier, or your luck can fail you with a lucky modifier.

Edit: Of course I forgot about those born with no modifier. Maybe they don't get one... or maybe they are considered positive but for the time are at 0.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:42 am 
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I dont know about all this talk here, one reason why its so bad to burn luck is because it has all kinds of negative consequences down the road. So, taking away those consequences sounds like potential trouble.

As for the with the lucky weapon, yes, at low leves you can swithc out your weapons if you drop into neg mods with luck but, what happens if you come across a magical long sword? Do you still want to not use your d8+magic bonus longsowrd in favor of a d6 mundane sword because of a luck penalty?

I also like the idea that a hero's luck can ebb and flow. Maybe what is needed is a more specific mechanic for how luck is regained. Maybe when a character levels up they get a number of luck points equal to the level they just achived in addition to any awards at the judges dicrestion? Any way, lets play test all these ideas and see how it works out!


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:53 am 
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"Beginner's Luck Rule"

Roll 1d10+8 for the starting luck stat. Guarantee's that there are no negatives to starting Luck & (with a d10 average of 5.5) skews everyone's Luck score towards the +bonuses. This to me is no big deal because beginners always seem to be a bit "luckier" anyway. I see no reason why beginning adventurers should be any different. :mrgreen: As they burn through their luck they turn into grizzled veteran adventures who lived long enough to get the needed skills to compensate for the dwindling supply of luck.

Any thoughts?


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:24 am 
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nice.. rolling 1d5+1d6+7 would make the results bell-curved, with an average of 13.5 and only 1 chance in 30 of getting either 9 or 18

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:14 am 
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abk108 wrote:
nice.. rolling 1d5+1d6+7 would make the results bell-curved, with an average of 13.5 and only 1 chance in 30 of getting either 9 or 18

Triangle-curved, technically. Need 3 or more dice for anything bell-shaped.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:43 am 
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jmucchiello wrote:
abk108 wrote:
nice.. rolling 1d5+1d6+7 would make the results bell-curved, with an average of 13.5 and only 1 chance in 30 of getting either 9 or 18

Triangle-curved, technically. Need 3 or more dice for anything bell-shaped.


You're right :? Well it's the best i could do :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:41 pm 
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abk108 wrote:
nice.. rolling 1d5+1d6+7 would make the results bell-curved, with an average of 13.5 and only 1 chance in 30 of getting either 9 or 18


Whatever floats your boat. :D I was deliberately skewing the results towards the "+" end based on the idea that Lady Luck has a "soft spot" for newbies... 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:03 pm 
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abk108 wrote:
jmucchiello wrote:
abk108 wrote:
nice.. rolling 1d5+1d6+7 would make the results bell-curved, with an average of 13.5 and only 1 chance in 30 of getting either 9 or 18

Triangle-curved, technically. Need 3 or more dice for anything bell-shaped.


You're right :? Well it's the best i could do :roll:

3d3 + 9?


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:17 pm 
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d3+d4+d5+6

Embrace the crazy.


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:24 pm 
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jmucchiello wrote:
3d3 + 9?


That would shift the minimum to 12, Tortog wanted to have results from 9 to 18, with the mid-line at 13.5 .... :?

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:27 pm 
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meinvt wrote:
d3+d4+d5+6

Embrace the crazy.


Yeah that works :P Range is 9-18, average is 13.5 .

Now the question that remains is : who's gonna pay for the players' analyst?! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:51 pm 
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abk108 wrote:
meinvt wrote:
d3+d4+d5+6

Embrace the crazy.

Yeah that works :P Range is 9-18, average is 13.5 .

Now the question that remains is : who's gonna pay for the players' analyst?! :lol:


LOL :lol: *cleaning up the tea I snarfed out my nose*

d3+d4+d5+6 But without zocchi dice its: (((d6/2)+d4+(d10/2))+6).... right :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 4:21 am 
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geordie racer wrote:
I dislike the steady powercreep of stackable +1 modifiers and prefer that a warrior's lucky weapon just ignores all negative Luck modifiers.

Using this method the lucky weapon is a greater boon to Low-luck characters or those whose Luck fluctuates to low levels due to burning it. Charcters who always keep their Luck high don't receive any extra benefit from the weapon, they're lucky enough anyway :wink:



Agree geordie here, why not side step the whole issue and state that a "Lucky weapon" has a better crit chance, or MDoA effect. That makes it "Lucky" but weather a player is any good with it depends on his usual stats, including what luck he is willing to burn on a hit.

If the player finds a magic weapon later in their questing that isnt of their "Lucky" type then thems the breaks! They have to make a call of bonuses to hit OR bonuses to Crit. It'd certainly be more thematic that they keep the old battered broadsword that was their first war trophy over the magic sword of eventual damnation (See magic weapons threads for what I mean there!)

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:44 am 
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Ducaster wrote:
geordie racer wrote:
I dislike the steady powercreep of stackable +1 modifiers and prefer that a warrior's lucky weapon just ignores all negative Luck modifiers.

Using this method the lucky weapon is a greater boon to Low-luck characters or those whose Luck fluctuates to low levels due to burning it. Charcters who always keep their Luck high don't receive any extra benefit from the weapon, they're lucky enough anyway :wink:



Agree geordie here, why not side step the whole issue and state that a "Lucky weapon" has a better crit chance, or MDoA effect. That makes it "Lucky" but weather a player is any good with it depends on his usual stats, including what luck he is willing to burn on a hit.

If the player finds a magic weapon later in their questing that isnt of their "Lucky" type then thems the breaks! They have to make a call of bonuses to hit OR bonuses to Crit. It'd certainly be more thematic that they keep the old battered broadsword that was their first war trophy over the magic sword of eventual damnation (See magic weapons threads for what I mean there!)


Instead of Lucky weapon, i would encourage a "favourite" weapon. A warrior is not good with swords because he's lucky, he's good because he trained with them his whole life, favouring them over other weapons.
A favourite weapon could get a +1 (or a bigger dice) for MDoA.

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:11 am 
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Tortog wrote:
d3+d4+d5+6 But without zocchi dice its: (((d6/2)+d4+(d10/2))+6).... right :lol:

Why not go all the way and roll d8/2 as well?


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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:02 pm 
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abk108 wrote:
Instead of Lucky weapon, i would encourage a "favourite" weapon. A warrior is not good with swords because he's lucky, he's good because he trained with them his whole life, favouring them over other weapons.
A favourite weapon could get a +1 (or a bigger dice) for MDoA.


This works well too. But it occurs to me that why don't we let the warriors get a random roll to see HOW there favored/Lucky/special weapon benefits them..?:-

1) +1 to hit
2) +2 Damage
3) use d24 for Crits
4) up one die type type for MDoA
5) Never fumble with "Lucky weapon" Re rolls to hit on Fumble instead.
6) One extra attack with special weapon at one dice less than the SMALLEST attack dice the warrior has
7) Quick draw. Warrior gets +3 to first attack only and a bonus to surprise when using their special weapon
8+) Etc etc.... ;)

The game already favors making characters unique by chance rolls like this. Whats one more between friends?

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My DCC spell work page is here https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1x_NmKhGbZLBukbWH78qR-38ebmMULEIbz1vt64YaILM


Last edited by Ducaster on Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Warriors: "Lucky Weapon"
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:33 pm 
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Love the random chart idea!


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