Goodman Games

Hi,

I've just started running DCC 54, my first Goodman Games module, and first return to D&D after many years. There are a couple of points that could use clarifying:

The doors between area 1-8A & 1-24. Are they blocked by a rockfall? The map seems to suggest they are, but the description of the goblin guard post seems to suggest you can get in that way. Similarly, is the passage between 1-20 & 1-22 blocked?

Area 1-16 states the stairs are 60' above, and the floor 30' below. But Area 1-17 gives the floor-to-stair distance as 60' total. A 90' fall is fairly fatal for any 1st level character failing their acrobatics check I think.

Who is the Mountain King? A dwarf? A goblinoid? It would just make the background little clearer if I knew who the faction that had found the dungeon ahead of the PCs were.

Lastly, a minor point; Area 1-3. How do two large creatures even fit in there, let alone fight?? And what are INT 1 zombies doing 'planning an ambush'?

I don't want anyone to think I'm not enjoying the module, and I've enough DMing experience to make changes where needed, but I did find myself having to re-read some parts several times due to these confusions. The ideal commercial module is one that can be run without multiple readings before the game starts.

regards

Simon

Simon,

You're absolutely right. First off, the errors aren't excusable. It's not our usual quality, mostly because we were caught in the 4E change over. The adventure was written without seeing the rules, converted by a 4E insider, and then edited again to WotC's errata.

This doesn't excuse the errors, but it does give some context around the first couple waves of DCCs, and why the future DCCs won't suffer from the same issues. (For instance, I would *love* to redo the map to make it larger ... or at least change the scale to 10' per square.)

Again, none of this excuses the errors.

//H

Kysmet wrote:Hi,
The doors between area 1-8A & 1-24. Are they blocked by a rockfall? The map seems to suggest they are, but the description of the goblin guard post seems to suggest you can get in that way. Similarly, is the passage between 1-20 & 1-22 blocked?

Yes, blocked. I need to check for 1-20 and 1-22.

Area 1-16 states the stairs are 60' above, and the floor 30' below. But Area 1-17 gives the floor-to-stair distance as 60' total. A 90' fall is fairly fatal for any 1st level character failing their acrobatics check I think.

I need to check here as well, but I'm fairly certain it is 60 ft total. Still pretty lethal for 1st lvl PCs though.

Who is the Mountain King? A dwarf? A goblinoid? It would just make the background little clearer if I knew who the faction that had found the dungeon ahead of the PCs were.

Ah... haven't you played Legacy of the Savage Kings yet? Yes, the Mountain King is a dwarven thane.

Lastly, a minor point; Area 1-3. How do two large creatures even fit in there, let alone fight?? And what are INT 1 zombies doing 'planning an ambush'?

Edition madness. At one point prior to conversion they weren't ogres, and they weren't undead.

//H

I'm going to add this thread to the official errata thread (sticky post at the top of this forum). We'll make sure to correct these in future printings. Thanks for the heads up.

Harley,

I am actually running this module as of right now. The usual group dm and I both felt that many parts of the map are just too small, especially for 4th Edition combat, for a group of 4 pc's. We have changed the scale of the map a bit, doubling the size of 1-1B and 1-4 and changed the ledge between to double squares. I think I'll just take your advice and count the squares at 10 feet a piece.

xredjasonx wrote:Harley,

I am actually running this module as of right now. The usual group dm and I both felt that many parts of the map are just too small, especially for 4th Edition combat, for a group of 4 pc's. We have changed the scale of the map a bit, doubling the size of 1-1B and 1-4 and changed the ledge between to double squares. I think I'll just take your advice and count the squares at 10 feet a piece.

Specifically, I rescaled a lot of the map, expanded combat challenges to make them more dynamic, and created new monsters (Blackhammer Warlock and Blackhammer Thane) to help maintain the theme of the adventure. You just got to reap the benefits of my work.

Harley Stroh wrote:Simon,

You're absolutely right. First off, the errors aren't excusable. It's not our usual quality, mostly because we were caught in the 4E change over. The adventure was written without seeing the rules, converted by a 4E insider, and then edited again to WotC's errata.

This doesn't excuse the errors, but it does give some context around the first couple waves of DCCs, and why the future DCCs won't suffer from the same issues. (For instance, I would *love* to redo the map to make it larger ... or at least change the scale to 10' per square.)

Again, none of this excuses the errors.

//H

It's understandable though, and the module is still a lot of fun. I'm not that experienced of a dm, only running a couple other DCC's before this one, and so I acquierd the help of Antioch, who is the groups usual dm. Looking forward to future DCC's for sure.

Antioch wrote:

xredjasonx wrote:Harley,

I am actually running this module as of right now. The usual group dm and I both felt that many parts of the map are just too small, especially for 4th Edition combat, for a group of 4 pc's. We have changed the scale of the map a bit, doubling the size of 1-1B and 1-4 and changed the ledge between to double squares. I think I'll just take your advice and count the squares at 10 feet a piece.

Specifically, I rescaled a lot of the map, expanded combat challenges to make them more dynamic, and created new monsters (Blackhammer Warlock and Blackhammer Thane) to help maintain the theme of the adventure. You just got to reap the benefits of my work.

Benefits? 25 cents an hour isn't enough for you? Lol

Oh yeah, I know. The only sucky part is that I end up being the player that knows whats gonna happen and have to like, pretend that I dont. Like that room with the flood trap: I tried to invent a way to avoid getting hit that seemed plausible.

Once i have a few more sessions under my belt you wont have to worry.

Hi everyone! I'm glad I found this thread. I'm a newbie DM and picked Forges of the Mountain King for my first adventure. I've run two sessions so far and we've gotten to just past the water trap.

I was pretty confused about how to move the big zombies around in the tiny room, too. I ended up drawing the room a bit larger so everybody would be able to move around. I tend to draw maps a little off from the real version because I am just awful at drawing, so it really wasn't much of a change from the status quo!

If anybody is interested in reading about my group's experience with the module, you can check it out on my blog. There's also my in-character campaign log for our Castle Whiterock game - if you'd like to see Castle Whiterock through the eyes of a valley girl Cleric of Moradin. (You've been warned!)

I've been playing this module for a couple of sessions now. We haven't done encounter 1-15 yet (The Thing in the Pit), but a level 9 Elite seems way overpowered for a low level dungeon. The DMG states encounters should be up to four levels higher than the party level. This thing has AC27, so you need +8 attack just to be able to hit it on anything other than a 20. How many 1st level characters have that sort of power? I'm thinking of replacing it with two gelatinous cubes straight out of the monster manual; same EL, and fits the theme of a patient, mindless lurker in the pit.

In cases like that, you can always nerf the monster. Not use one of its abilities, lower the AC a bit, make it a little MORE vulnerable to a certain kind of attack (radiant, etc). Or maybe I just don't like fighting cubes of jello...

GeeksDreamGirl,

I have nothing to add to this thread, since I'm a Castles & Crusader, but I wanted to welcome you aboard the Goodman Games forums.

Kysmet wrote:I've been playing this module for a couple of sessions now. We haven't done encounter 1-15 yet (The Thing in the Pit), but a level 9 Elite seems way overpowered for a low level dungeon. The DMG states encounters should be up to four levels higher than the party level. This thing has AC27, so you need +8 attack just to be able to hit it on anything other than a 20. How many 1st level characters have that sort of power? I'm thinking of replacing it with two gelatinous cubes straight out of the monster manual; same EL, and fits the theme of a patient, mindless lurker in the pit.

I think you guys have a point. Try using the critter below in the encounter, instead of the one in the adventure. It's still a tough fight, but will likely be more manageable for low-level characters.

BD

Giant Skeletal Water Snake Level 3 Solo Soldier
Large natural beast (undead) XP 750
Initiative +4 Senses Perception +3; darkvision
HP 192; Bloodied 96
AC 21; Fort 18, Ref16, Will 14
Resist 10 necrotic; Vulnerable 5 radiant
Saving Throws +5
Speed 7, climb 6, swim 6
Action Points 2
[M] Bite (standard; at-will)
+10 vs. AC; 1d10+4 damage, and the target is grabbed (until escape).
[m] Constrict (standard; at will):
Affects a target the giant skeletal water snake has grabbed; +8 vs. Fortitude; 1d10+8 damage, and the target is dazed until the end of the snake’s next turn.
Alignment Unaligned Languages –
Skills Stealth +7
Str 18 (+5) Dex 12 (+1) Wis 14 (+3)
Con 16 (+4) Int 2 (-3) Cha 10 (+1)

JediOre wrote:GeeksDreamGirl,

I have nothing to add to this thread, since I'm a Castles & Crusader, but I wanted to welcome you aboard the Goodman Games forums.

Thanks, Jedi.

Blackdirge wrote:
I think you guys have a point. Try using the critter below in the encounter, instead of the one in the adventure. It's still a tough fight, but will likely be more manageable for low-level characters.

Hi Aeryn,

that's much better than my idea, thanks for the swift response. I just hope they go that way in the dungeon now!

Simon

GeeksDreamGirl wrote:...Or maybe I just don't like fighting cubes of jello...

I love those good, old, completely-gonzo, how'd-they-think-of-that, old-school "cubes of jello" -- There's one in my avatar, for Melf's sake!

Hopefully, this won't dissuade you from continuing posting... Welcome aboard.

GnomeBoy wrote: I love those good, old, completely-gonzo, how'd-they-think-of-that, old-school "cubes of jello"

Continuing the culinary theme for monsters, I always loved the Black Pudding, another ooze type creature named after an English type of blood-pudding!

Kysmet wrote:

Blackdirge wrote:
I think you guys have a point. Try using the critter below in the encounter, instead of the one in the adventure. It's still a tough fight, but will likely be more manageable for low-level characters.

Hi Aeryn,

that's much better than my idea, thanks for the swift response. I just hope they go that way in the dungeon now!

Simon

No problem. That monster was actually my oversight anyway. On a general note, if you guys have any issues with any monsters in these 4E adventures, let me know. I'll either point you in the right direction, or post a quick fix like I did here.

BD

GnomeBoy wrote:Hopefully, this won't dissuade you from continuing posting... Welcome aboard.

It'll take a lot more than that to scare me away.

Hi guys. Thanks for the errata and new/replacement monster.

I've just started to run this for my kids (12, 10 and 9). When I first bought it I thought it would be part 1 of a series of modules but now I'm thinking this isn't so.

Will there be a 'part 2' to this module or will I either be creating something on my own or moving on to another unrelated module?

Thanks!

rv

Rich,

Wyvern Mountain is #2 of 3. It should be in stores shortly.

http://www.goodman-games.com/5056preview.html

//H

Er... 2 of 4.

Well, heck, actually #2 of an ongoing series.

//H

Harley Stroh wrote:Rich,

Wyvern Mountain is #2 of 3. It should be in stores shortly.

http://www.goodman-games.com/5056preview.html

//H

My group is patiently waiting.