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 Post subject: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:30 am 
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I'm in the middle of designing my own patron and I'm having a hard time devising some spells for them. Using the examples provided in the rulebook for inspiration I was finishing up some details on the first spell and I noticed what I think is a reference to Vecna.
On page 337 there is a picture of what I assume is a wizard invoking Sezrekan and at his feet are a hand and an eye. These could just be a couple of material components that the wizard is sacrificing, or using to make his spell work, but I couldn't help and think of the infamous hand and eye of Vecna. Especially of Sezrekan is the "wickedest of wizards" that he has somehow achieved a greater level of power than Vecna ever had.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:47 am 
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Good eye. :mrgreen:
I missed those details in the picture.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:57 am 
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Possible, although the idea of the hand and eye of Vecna were taken form an even earlier literary source: Moorcock's Corum stories.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:12 am 
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Ravenheart87 wrote:
Possible, although the idea of the hand and eye of Vecna were taken form an even earlier literary source: Moorcock's Corum stories.


I thought they were probably lifted from something even earlier than that.
"The Raven" with Vincent Price has him making a potion with a dead man's hand and frog's eyes, or maybe it was a dead man's eyes and a frog's hand...

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 7:15 am 
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And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.


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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 7:54 am 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.


:shock: I cannot believe I never noticed that. :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:21 am 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.


Over thirty years and I never made that connection... :shock: You have just blown my mind!

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:21 pm 
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Vecna would make an awesome patron.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 4:05 pm 
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Blood Axe wrote:
Vecna would make an awesome patron.


As far as I know, Vecna is now WotC's IP. How about an anagram of Vecna? Let's see......Vance! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 4:31 pm 
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Well, any evil Wizard Lich missing a few body parts might serve. :D. It doesn't have to be an anagram.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:11 pm 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.

I totally missed that :oops: ... at least I'm not alone :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:45 am 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.

So many people missed it. I thought it was common knowledge. Even wikipedia mentions it. :)

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:51 am 
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Ravenheart87 wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.

So many people missed it. I thought it was common knowledge. Even wikipedia mentions it. :)


Oh sure, NOW it does! I remember a time when there was no reference to Vecna on wikipedia, nor did he have his own page.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:05 am 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.
Gygax, et all, did that a lot. I know that in the Greyhawk campaign there are a couple dozen names which, if descrambled, turn out to be regular names. Drawmij, for example, is "Jim Ward" backwards and is ironic because as I understand it Jim can't even use his own name backwards in a gaming product because WotC owns the IP for the name.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:31 am 
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finarvyn wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.
Gygax, et all, did that a lot. I know that in the Greyhawk campaign there are a couple dozen names which, if descrambled, turn out to be regular names. Drawmij, for example, is "Jim Ward" backwards and is ironic because as I understand it Jim can't even use his own name backwards in a gaming product because WotC owns the IP for the name.


Wow! I didn't know that either.

Nystul is pretty obvious.
But Mordenkainen?
Bigby?
Otiluke?
Tenser?
I can't imagine any of these are anagrams of real peoples' names.

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:15 pm 
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Mordenkainen's name was inspired by Finnish mythology.
Tenser is an anagram for Ernest (as in Ernest "Ernie" Gygax, Gary's son and Tenser's player).
Otiluke may be a reference to both a PC of Gygax's named Otis and his son Luke.


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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:33 pm 
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nerdwerds wrote:
finarvyn wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.
Gygax, et all, did that a lot. I know that in the Greyhawk campaign there are a couple dozen names which, if descrambled, turn out to be regular names. Drawmij, for example, is "Jim Ward" backwards and is ironic because as I understand it Jim can't even use his own name backwards in a gaming product because WotC owns the IP for the name.


Wow! I didn't know that either.

Nystul is pretty obvious.
But Mordenkainen?
Bigby?
Otiluke?
Tenser?
I can't imagine any of these are anagrams of real peoples' names.

...And in this vein, it is probably redundant of me to mention that Melf (of the Acid Arrow fame) was what a player of Gygax's came up with when he needed a name for his character, a male Elf...

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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 6:50 pm 
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Raven_Crowking wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.


:shock: I cannot believe I never noticed that. :oops:


nerdwerds wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
And of course, Vecna is an anagram for Vance.


Over thirty years and I never made that connection... :shock: You have just blown my mind!


My DM in college pointed that out to me to convince me to read Vance. I'd tried one of Vance's books as a kid and thought it was just weird.


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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 9:16 pm 
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Bilgewriggler wrote:
...I'd tried one of Vance's books as a kid and thought it was just weird.


Wait -- you mean 'weird' isn't what I'm supposed to like about them...???

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Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: A reference to Vecna?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:11 pm 
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GnomeBoy wrote:
Bilgewriggler wrote:
...I'd tried one of Vance's books as a kid and thought it was just weird.


Wait -- you mean 'weird' isn't what I'm supposed to like about them...???


:D

At 10 or 12, I was a very literal reader with a tendency to skip descriptive paragraphs. Not great qualities for appreciating Vance.


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