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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:02 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:47 pm
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ghostisluminous wrote:
finarvyn wrote:
ghostisluminous wrote:
I learned to play D&D with the chits from my first box set.
Just curious ... white box or blue box? The only D&D that I can recall with chits included was the blue "Holmes" version.


I guess it was what's called the Blue Box. It was a full color box, there was a red dragon on the front, and I believe a Knight and a Wizard. The Rulebook inside was indeed blue. A blue halftone of the box cover art.


Well this is getting pretty far afield of the topic, but...at least some of the "blue book" Holmes boxes had dice. Mine did. They were the same super-soft plastic ones TSR sold in the 70's. pic: http://zenopusarchives.blogspot.com/2012/04/veteran-of-dice-wars.html I still have 'em, though they're so worn and chipped up they're pretty far from usable.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:02 pm 
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The one I bought for my brother had chits.

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Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:11 pm 
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Raven_Crowking wrote:
The one I bought for my brother had chits.

IIRC, there was a point where the dice were unavailable from the manufacturer, and the chits were a stop-gap measure in order to keep product on shelves...

_________________
Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 5:25 am 
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GnomeBoy wrote:
Raven_Crowking wrote:
The one I bought for my brother had chits.
IIRC, there was a point where the dice were unavailable from the manufacturer, and the chits were a stop-gap measure in order to keep product on shelves...
Correct, GB. TSR produced Holmes sets with dice, then had to rely on chits for a while, then back to the dice.

Dice are much more fun, although I guess if chits had caught on more (except for the old wargamer crowd) maybe the DCC game would have been chit-based and then you could have every dX imaginable! :lol:

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"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 3:43 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2012 8:59 am
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Colin wrote:
I think part of my problem with the assumption is that so far it seems to be more about a whole book of this, a whole book of that, etc. This is why I prefer the Annual approach, where you could potentially get a nice, varied selection of such material in a single book. You get more content, but you don't get deluged with extra volumes in the process. Folks who want whole volumes dedicated to these topics can pick up third party books, all of which are personally vetted by Joseph, by the way.

Part of the reason I'm not keen on the idea of a complete bestiary book in particular is that you're simply going to end up with a bunch of new monsters that, given a short period of time, become "standard", and having a lot of "standard" monsters is something DCC seems to want to avoid. It then doesn't take long before folks want another monster volume, because they've used the first to the point that much of it is old hat. I'd much rather see baseline creatures/templates (including normal animals), and a bunch of cool tables to then randomly customize or select from as needed, supported by a moderate selection of weird critters to demonstrate its utility. Just like the RECG.

Colin


+1

I can not say it better. :)

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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 10:45 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:39 pm
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finarvyn wrote:
GnomeBoy wrote:
Raven_Crowking wrote:
The one I bought for my brother had chits.
IIRC, there was a point where the dice were unavailable from the manufacturer, and the chits were a stop-gap measure in order to keep product on shelves...
Correct, GB. TSR produced Holmes sets with dice, then had to rely on chits for a while, then back to the dice.

Dice are much more fun, although I guess if chits had caught on more (except for the old wargamer crowd) maybe the DCC game would have been chit-based and then you could have every dX imaginable! :lol:


Great idea! A 7-day prescription box and chits for d's 3,5,7,14,16,24 and 30. Shake box, open compartment, draw chit (roll.) Customizing the pill box will be fun! Thanks for the inspiration!


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 10:47 am 
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goodmangames wrote:
No plans for additional rules supplements. I would like the same "easy of entry" 5 years from now as exists now: 1 rulebook, 1 easy choice, no "catching up" to pre-existing players. One additional Annual each year, with optional material, based on learnings and inspirations from that previous year's play. And a boatload of modules!


You sir, have made the correct choice here.

I'm in.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:54 am 
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So... when do we see the first "Annual"? :D


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:31 am 
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A game publisher that is more concerned with quality than quantity?

You guys are really taking that whole 1970s thing literally, aren't you?


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:42 pm 
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Except that here, there seems to actually be some regard for quality :)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:44 pm 
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Gizrond wrote:
A game publisher that is more concerned with quality than quantity?

You guys are really taking that whole 1970s thing literally, aren't you?


How very Chaosium/GDW of them :twisted:


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 4:37 am 
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cthulhudarren wrote:
So... when do we see the first "Annual"? :D
Joseph ought to weigh in on this issue, but I think there is a bit of a misconception about the Annuals.

The way I remember it, Joseph's plan was to do a single core rulebook and then move on to produce only modules from there on.

Then some folks on the boards started asking about supplementary rulebooks. Could we have more monsters? Could we have more spells? Could we have more classes? Could we have more rulebooks?

I believe that Joseph's response was sort of a vague "I was hoping that third parties would take care of this need, bit if we have enough things to publish Goodman Games might be able to cobble together an occasional supplement. Maybe an Annual." (Not a direct quote but I think I captured the spirit of it; I'd have to search for the appropriate thread on this topic.)

Teflon Billy's quote a few posts up gives a sense as to Joseph's direction on this, I think. As far as I know, such an Annual hasn't even been started yet, I'm not sure that it's even "on the radar" at the moment, and I doubt that any potential contents of an Annual have been projected. Heck, at the moment an Annual would probably be mostly either errata or reprints of articles from Crawl. :lol:

Remember that Goodman Games isn't actually a large company even though they seem to produce a lot of product, and the writers have been working really hard in the past few months to get the DCC product line off the ground. Between writing, playtesting, and proofreading of a giant core rulebook and eight modules, I suspect that Joseph & Co are pretty tired right now.

Just my take on it. As I mentioned, Joseph should probably give a more official and more updated answer to this.

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DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11
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DCC RPG playtester 2011, C&C playtester 2003,T&T since 2003,
ADRP Since 1993, OD&D player since 1975

"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:51 am 
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http://www.goodman-games.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=78&t=42153&p=90101#p90101

"Harley Stroh
Post subject: Re: Beyond The Black Gate
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 10:43 am

We definitely have more adventures on the way! Speaking only to my personal projects, we are waiting on the cover art for one, and I have two more after that in the immediate hopper. Which doesn't even touch on the adventures being written by other folks, or the upcoming Annual."

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Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:40 am 
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Nice catch, Jon. I recall the thread but had forgotten the mention of an annual.

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Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11
Image
DCC RPG playtester 2011, C&C playtester 2003,T&T since 2003,
ADRP Since 1993, OD&D player since 1975

"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:22 am 
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...of course, "upcoming Annual" might still mean next Spring or Summer. The anniversary of the game's release would not be a bad date...

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Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:09 pm 
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I for one would prefer game 'aids' over rulebooks. As much as I think the hardback tome kicks booty, I wouldn't mind a smaller, more table friendly softcover for chart references. Perhaps a 'chart only' reference book. Naturally, I can just make copies and binder them...

Also my vote goes for GM screen (both common and limited) and Official dice perhaps even a limited version!

Keep the adventures coming! I think the current design philosophy is right on target!


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:14 pm 
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fishgeekted wrote:
I think the current design philosophy is right on target!

+2d37

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Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:56 pm 
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GnomeBoy wrote:
fishgeekted wrote:
I think the current design philosophy is right on target!

+2d37


Where can I buy a 37-sided die?!?!? :D :lol:

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SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:07 pm 
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I keep them with my one-siders...

*thinks 'doesn't everybody?'*

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Gnome Boy (a.k.a. "Jon") • DCC play-tester @ DDC 35, Feb 2011. • Beta DL 2111, 7:00 AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since 1977 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters - Holds the power to play gnomes at will!

Here Be DCC Monsters...

General Yoros, Warrior, Str 13, Agl 8 (10), Stm 17, Per 13, Int 11, Lck 8; Law, HP 39, AC 17, R+2, F+4, W+2, band/shld, warhammer, longsword, longbow, pitchfork

Han Dee, (Weaver) Neutral Thief, Str 10, Agi 13, Stm 11, Per 11, Int 15, Lck 14, AC 13 (Leather), HP 25, Luck Die d6, Backstab 3, Sneak Silently 10, Hide In Shadows 9, Pick Pocket 10, Climb Sheer 10, Pick Lock 9, Find Trap 9, Disable Trap 9, Forge Doc 10, Disguise 3, Read Lang 5, Handle Poison 3, Cast Scroll d14+2, birth augur (Born under the loom) +1 to all skill checks (including thief skills), Banepicks (auto pick lock/disable trap, but lose 1d3 random ability loss, if a 3 then 1 pt is perm)


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:08 am 
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My d37 keeps rolling "40". Most perplexing.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:26 pm 
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Ill-Fated Peasant

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Posts: 7
I'm in the "No More Rulebooks" Camp. This is why Hasbro/Wizards
is doing so poorly. They created the Monstrous "Edition Wars" trying
to get everyone to buy new D&D books like Magic cards. The gravy
train is empty. I hope I never have to hear, "Man, you're not using
Advanced DCC RPG 2.0 yet??"

I'll be honest, I was pretty peeved off when TSR went from 1st to 2nd
Edition & pretty much never moved past 1st Edition. Although I bought
a few of the settings or alternate rules books when novel ideas were
presented, like Book of Vile Darkness, Domain of Dread, &
Savage Species, but I splintered off to other RPGs when AD&D 2nd
edition popped out.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 2:40 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

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Posts: 44
I love that there won't be rule book bloat. I do however have one request, a book of monsters from the previous 3.5 and 4e editions of the adventures.

I'd be happy if some were part of the annuals or if the annual had some back of the envelope on they fly type of conversion for these critters.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 6:34 pm 
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Posts: 7
darjr wrote:
I love that there won't be rule book bloat. I do however have one request, a book of monsters from the previous 3.5 and 4e editions of the adventures.

I'd be happy if some were part of the annuals or if the annual had some back of the envelope on they fly type of conversion for these critters.


Monsters should be setting specific. When you think of generic AD&D what
do you think of? For me, it conjures up Githyanki, Drow, colorful Dragons,
Demons/Devils with a defined Plane, Slime/Mold/Oozes, Orcs, Demi-humans,
Beholders, Mind Flayers, & so on. Basically the whole staple of a select group
of monsters, that every Player and DM would already own a copy of for AD&D.
The monsters encountered with just the base rule books would then be
rigidly defined generics that anyone interested in the game, which would
then be called "Canon" DCC RPG, would come to always expect when
running a DCC RPG game. You take away those generic monsters, you
take away a large section of content that is ingrained in every person that
bought Monster Manual & now has to discard that...so why would they even
play AD&D at that point, if it didn't have the staple creatures? So then what
you have are "Canon Wars" that hardcore Players would expect from Judges.
Just like if you expanded the rule books, you would get "Edition Wars" &
splintered groups, so it goes with canon material. Expanding anything from
the core is a slippery slope that can damage the novelty of sticking with
that classic OD&D feel, where everything was new & fresh at the time the
first RPG was created.

So I think they should avoid generic monster manuals. GURPS did the same
thing & now I can see why. People generated custom manuals online for
GURPS but that won't upset the canonistas because they won't go into
a GURPS game expecting to choose to play the Drow Elf Race or battle
Beholders or Intellect Devourers (using the D&D analogy). It will be
whatever the GM decided it will be based on the setting or game-style
brought up at the start of the game.

Therefore, the best place to introduce a monster manual would be in a
structured Campaign Setting. So if GG or a third party creates a campaign
setting, then include the monster manual with that. That will prevent
the core rules from being painted into a specific corner & keep the
canonistas tied to the campaign setting in use. With campaign settings
you can have specific canon, multiple editions (usually moving forward
in the setting's history or introducing new elements), and/or annual
updates without damaging the core.

Anyway, just a few thoughts I thought I'd pass on, good or bad.


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 8:21 pm 
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centisteed, I think your ideas are pretty good. Basically monsters should be setting specific, which is part of why GG is trying to create more unique monsters instead of stereotyped ones. Most of the Appendix N books have some sort of nasty at the end that the characters must confront and overcome, and the less they know about it the more creepy and suspenseful the encounter.

On the other hand, I don't mind some generic monsters, either. Some settings (such as Poul Anderson's The Broken Sword) center around both humans and a second non-human race. Robert E. Howard's Conan books often feature a pict race of not-quite-humans. So there are clearly examples of where generic DCC monsters could fit well into some campaign worlds.

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Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11
Image
DCC RPG playtester 2011, C&C playtester 2003,T&T since 2003,
ADRP Since 1993, OD&D player since 1975

"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson


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 Post subject: Re: So GG is not putting out more DCC rulebooks?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:49 pm 
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Location: Austin, TX
darjr wrote:
I love that there won't be rule book bloat. I do however have one request, a book of monsters from the previous 3.5 and 4e editions of the adventures.


I have the Swords & Wizardry version of Tome of Horrors for this. 650+ pages of monsters is a glorious thing. :)

I don't need more rules (or monsters), but I would like more spells & patrons and a series of campaign settings. (Looking forward to the IndieGogo Patrons book in development.) And obviously more adventures, because Goodman adventures are the best, period.


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