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Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ
http://www.goodman-games.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=27644
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Author:  Logon [ Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo!

Grappling p96 :
Each party makes opposed attack rolls, adding the higher of their Agility or Strength modifier.

but NPCs and monsters has no abilities.

Author:  Harley Stroh [ Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:23 am ]
Post subject:  Sailors: Missing Door

phg wrote:
Area B-1 (Tomb of the Fallen).

The entrance from the south-east text describes "A strange and foreboding portal bars your way." However, the tomb map illustrates that entrance as a twisting hall opening directly into the tomb.


Yes ... we're missing a door on the map, an error on my part. I'll cross post this over on Stomp the Typo.

//H

Author:  Harley Stroh [ Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo!

Colin was great enough to copy and paste questions that are also appearing elsewhere. Hope to have the chance to compile these (and everything else) in the OP, time permitting.

Quote:
Currently Unanswered Questions
1) p20 Demihumans are said to speak their racial tongue only if they have Int 8+, but elsewhere the text is not clear, and it seems they speak them automatically.

2) p32 Otyughs are mentioned in Turn Unholy, but I can't find any references.

3) Does the Thief getting the modifier to Intelligence mean that he can only cast Wizard spells?

4) p57 Luck: the wording is not appropriate, or the description is wrong since the Luck modifier can be negative (so after all those years of practicing, they still get the spell wrong?)

5) p.60 Halflings lack the Slow characteristic like Dwarves (as elsewhere it's mentioned they move 20'.)

6) p.61 Large part of the page is empty. Was something meant to be there?

7) Table 3-5 in the Equipment chapter: what's the purpose of the Weight column? No other equipment has weight listed, and the Barding refers to weight of normal sized armor which doesn't exist.

8 ) p.82 last entry of the table an Helm is mentioned, but there is none in the equipment lists, and it's not clear whether helms are part of armor or not. Not sure Helms are mentioned elsewhere.

9) Mounted Combat. It's specified that trained characters get +2 to the roll, but there are already training rules, by which a trained character rolls d20, an untrained one rolls d10.

10) Undead are specified as being immune to hold. But there is no hold spell.

11) Do we track the change in luck bonuses for e.g. fumble modifier, when players burn and gain luck?

The biggie is that we now need the writeups of the 4th-level Magic Wand and Magic Rod spells as Harley said they were not deliberately left out (and so are errata).


//H

Author:  Harley Stroh [ Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

The latest. Thank you, Colin!

Quote:
Agility and Missile Damage
On the character sheets on the beta pdf, the Agility mod is added to Missile damage. In the released rules, any mention of this is either absent, or I missed it.
Was it cut?

Surprise
In chapter 4 (combat), you can learn that the rolls for initiative is based on the result of the surprise roll. Below, you can read that characters who were not aware of the opponents are surprised. Okay... but how does it apply (in terms of rules) ? Surprised characters miss a round ? Or take penalty ? Or act at the end of the round ?

Initiative
is initiative dynamic or static? Do the players roll every new round or just at the beginning?

Luck Tracking
Do we track the change in luck bonuses for e.g. fumble modifier, when players burn and gain luck?
I know the luck bonus for special ability is fixed at level 0, and I thought this applied to all uses of luck, but then I read on p110 that for mercurial magic tables, you use wizard's luck modifier 'at the time the wizard learns the new spell...
I presume you do change modifiers when other abilities are temporarily affected?

Luck and Perceptiveness
Say I have Luck 14 (+1), and I’m not a thief/Halfling.
I burn 4 points, so my Luck is now 10 (+0)
Because Luck is used for listen checks, does this now mean I can’t hear as well as I once could?

Level 6 Spells?
The abilities table says you can learn level 6 spells, but there are none in the book and the wizard table only goes up to level 5.

Mounted Combat
Mounted combat seems also a bit confusing.
To avoid falling from a horse you roll a D10... against what?
If you are trained because of your occupation you get a +2?
Doesn't your dice change to a d20?

Author:  Colin [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

You're welcome. One more for the actual finished FAQ:

Q: When creating a magic sword using the Sword Magic spell, do you make a spell check for each column and for Alignment, or is it one spell check for the entire row? Also, does the spell burn apply to each check, or do you have to spell burn for each check?
A: One spell check for "the entire row" on the table, with one set of spellburn applied.

Author:  Banesfinger [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Reprint from the "Character Sheets" thread:

Quote:
Thanks for these class-specific sheets, but I've found a few things which I can't find in the rules (I assume it was playtest stuff):

Next to Agility, there is a box for "Missile Damage". I can't find a reference to this in the rules.
Cleric sheet: under the lay-on-hands chart; it has reference to "CL" instead of the "dice" chart on page 31.
Wizard: under spells, what is supposed to go in the "check" area?

Minor Stuff
If each sheet is specific to class, you could probably pre-fill the "Class" area on the sheet.
On spellcasters (Wiz, Cleric, etc) you may want a space for "Caster Level"
Thief sheet: automatically add "thieves cant" to the languages section.
Luck: since any class may 'burn' luck points, it might be desirable to split the luck box (just like the Thief and Halfling sheets).
Dwarf/Elf/Halfling: you may want to automatically add their racial language.
Elf: you may want to add the elven immunities (e.g. sleep, paralysis).
Halfling/Elf/Dwarf: for infravision, point out the distance (e.g. 30-feet).
Warrior/Dwarf sheets: in the 'combat basics' box, you may want to re-label "attack" to "attack/damage/deed die".

Author:  Tush Hog [ Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Giant and ghoul are out of alphabetical order in the bestiary.

Author:  Flexi [ Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

I think there is an error. Someone please correct me if I have got it wrong or repeated someone else. Someone else made this observation on a thread on rpg.net before.

p. 86 Crit table V is for level 5+ Warriors but on table 1-14 on p.54 the level table for dwarves (dwarfs?!?), shows that levels 6 to 10 have the level V crit table as well.
Crit table IV on p.85 shows that it is for level 4+ dwarves.
Which is correct?

Author:  Colin [ Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Flexi wrote:
I think I have spotted an error. Someone please correct me if I have got it wrong or repeated someone else.

p. 86 Crit table V is for level 5+ Warriors but on table 1-14 on p.54 the level table for dwarves (dwarfs?!?), shows that levels 6 to 10 have the level V crit table as well.


Well spotted, but yep it's already reported earlier in the thread. :)

Colin

Author:  Flexi [ Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Missed that. Sorry! :oops:

Author:  Colin [ Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Flexi wrote:
Missed that. Sorry! :oops:


No worries. The thread will need some serious cleaning and pruning once the errata is officially updated, so hopefully it'll be a lot easier to sift through thereafter. :)

Colin

Author:  rabindranath72 [ Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Flexi wrote:
dwarfs?!?

Yup. That's "proper" English. Dwarves is a "Tolkien invention" when referring to the race in his setting. In fact, Warhammer FRP (a Very English RPG) has always used "dwarfs."

Author:  goodmangames [ Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo!

Jim Skach wrote:
However, I will henceforth be calling my son, and he will be signing up for GaryCon under the name of, Collin...

:lol:

Hey..you got the last name right - which is more than those slackers over at Adventurer, Conqueror, King can say!

:lol:


I'll make sure this gets corrected in the 2nd printing. :)

Author:  goodmangames [ Wed Jun 20, 2012 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Thanks to everyone for posting the errata identified in this thread. The second printing has been sent to the printer, and it addresses everything identified here (including an index). When I get a chance I will type out answers to the various open questions in this thread, as corrected in the second printing.

The first printing will likely sell out (from our warehouse) in the next 7-14 days. Get it while you can!

And Doug is working on a kickass new cover for the second alternate cover edition...

Author:  Stainless [ Wed Jun 20, 2012 10:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Congratulations on an instant success. Also, congratulations on incorporating errata in a second printing and not waiting, like many companies, until a second edition. Very professional.

Author:  Ravenheart87 [ Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

A well deserved victory, my liege.

Author:  mindshadow2k [ Thu Jun 21, 2012 2:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Will there be an official place to download a pdf of both the errata and index?

Author:  finarvyn [ Thu Jun 21, 2012 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

goodmangames wrote:
And Doug is working on a kickass new cover for the second alternate cover edition...

Wait ... so there will be a THIRD cover to collect? :shock:

Author:  Ravenheart87 [ Thu Jun 21, 2012 10:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

mindshadow2k wrote:
Will there be an official place to download a pdf of both the errata and index?

I suppose it's going to be uploaded here, plus the pdf is going to be updated at DriveThruRPG.

Author:  rabindranath72 [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 1:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

To be honest I feel ripped off. That's a pretty large list of errata, whole blocks of text missing, no index, and a 2nd printing almost out to fix all of it. It's quite clear that the book should have had at least another editing pass. I strongly feel I should not have pre-ordered, and I will not likely do again in the future :(

Author:  Raven_Crowking [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

rabindranath72 wrote:
To be honest I feel ripped off. That's a pretty large list of errata, whole blocks of text missing, no index, and a 2nd printing almost out to fix all of it. It's quite clear that the book should have had at least another editing pass. I strongly feel I should not have pre-ordered, and I will not likely do again in the future :(


I do not work for Goodman Games (although I respect those guys a lot), and I feel for you. Truly, I do. And I agree that it should have had another editing pass. Heck, I wish I had gotten a chance to do that editing pass!

But....I am glad I pre-ordered. And I am glad that I got this game when I did, even if that means I am going to also buy the second printing. That problems will be fixed in the second printing is not because Goodman Games wanted to rip us off, but because they are committed to minimizing problems in the future. I cannot help but believe that this is not only a damn good thing, but a rare one as well.

RC

Author:  rabindranath72 [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Raven_Crowking wrote:
rabindranath72 wrote:
To be honest I feel ripped off. That's a pretty large list of errata, whole blocks of text missing, no index, and a 2nd printing almost out to fix all of it. It's quite clear that the book should have had at least another editing pass. I strongly feel I should not have pre-ordered, and I will not likely do again in the future :(


I do not work for Goodman Games (although I respect those guys a lot), and I feel for you. Truly, I do. And I agree that it should have had another editing pass. Heck, I wish I had gotten a chance to do that editing pass!

But....I am glad I pre-ordered. And I am glad that I got this game when I did, even if that means I am going to also buy the second printing. That problems will be fixed in the second printing is not because Goodman Games wanted to rip us off, but because they are committed to minimizing problems in the future. I cannot help but believe that this is not only a damn good thing, but a rare one as well.

RC

I am not a professional editor, and I spotted lots of errors on the first read. I don't know how many editors GG employs, but evidently they are not enough, or are not good enough. They could rely on fans, who apparently do a much better job than professionals; and would work for free or a pdf. I am definitely not happy.

Author:  Raven_Crowking [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

rabindranath72 wrote:
Raven_Crowking wrote:
rabindranath72 wrote:
To be honest I feel ripped off. That's a pretty large list of errata, whole blocks of text missing, no index, and a 2nd printing almost out to fix all of it. It's quite clear that the book should have had at least another editing pass. I strongly feel I should not have pre-ordered, and I will not likely do again in the future :(


I do not work for Goodman Games (although I respect those guys a lot), and I feel for you. Truly, I do. And I agree that it should have had another editing pass. Heck, I wish I had gotten a chance to do that editing pass!

But....I am glad I pre-ordered. And I am glad that I got this game when I did, even if that means I am going to also buy the second printing. That problems will be fixed in the second printing is not because Goodman Games wanted to rip us off, but because they are committed to minimizing problems in the future. I cannot help but believe that this is not only a damn good thing, but a rare one as well.

RC

I am not a professional editor, and I spotted lots of errors on the first read. I don't know how many editors GG employs, but evidently they are not enough, or are not good enough. They could rely on fans, who apparently do a much better job than professionals; and would work for free or a pdf. I am definitely not happy.


I understand what you are saying, even if I don't feel ripped off in the slightest. Certainly, the initial editing left something to be desired....but there is clearly a lot of love (and value) received for the price, IMHO. The page count, paper stock, and binding alone make me doubt that there is more than a sliver of profit margin on this book at the price I paid. I've paid more for much less, with just as much errata, and with no hope of that errata getting addressed in the next printing. But I agree with you about the editing. That was....unfortunate, to say the least.

Rather than just feeling unhappy about it, though, what would you propose that Goodman Games now does? What do you think would be fair?


RC

Author:  rabindranath72 [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

Raven_Crowking wrote:
Rather than just feeling unhappy about it, though, what would you propose that Goodman Games now does? What do you think would be fair?


RC

Sure there are some companies for which bugs are "features" (I won't make names, but you probably know them; at the 4th printing of their books THERE ARE STILL ERRORS OF THE FIRST PRINTING.) I would be FIRED if I behaved the same with my daily job.
I simply expected more in this case, exactly for the reasons you mention: a labor of love, delayed for many months, overall high quality etc. It's like finding a small fly in a superb cake.

Something similar happened to Mongoose Publishing when they sold the Conan RPG. The first printing had some similar problems to the ones here. First, Mongoose FIRED the persons responsible for the debacle. Second, Mongoose gave away the 2nd printings (the famous Atlantean Edition) at a huge discount (more than 50% IIRC) provided you sent them a corner of the previous book to prove that you had bought it. I have been a faithful customer since then. I don't know how laws work in the USA, but here in Europe it would be in my right as a customer to ask for a refund since the object does not live to my expectations (it could be considered "defective".) If I had bought it off Amazon, I would have sent it back for sure.

Author:  Dark Lord [ Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stomp the typo / Errata & FAQ

As somebody who got the $75 book...yeah, the fact that a new edition is on its way that has fixed all the errors IS a bit frustrating.

I like this book a lot, and so far have had a great time turning back the clock, laughing at some silly dice results, and horrible low level PC deaths...not to mention getting excited about tracking down "weird little dice" again. But I can't help be feel a little foolish for paying $75 when I could have waited, paid almost half of that, and got a complete product.

I would appreciate a PDF of the fixed copy, or some other gesture to say, "Sorry about that. Thanks for your continued support."

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