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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:02 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:27 pm
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Location: Portland, OR.
Yes it is most certainly that Guardian Games in PDX. I live in SE Portland and head there from time to time. Usually closer to Mondays as I have a regular Monday night game, just about fifth lvl now and have only run Sellswords of Punjar and Dragora's Dungeon (our group is based in Punjar and I love the Lankhmar feel, especially now that I have Felis and huntin' for Whisker, Grey Mouser!). I think I do plan to head to the Beer and Pizza night this evening around seven pm. You in the hood here?


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:25 pm 
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Vellen wrote:
Yes it is most certainly that Guardian Games in PDX. I live in SE Portland and head there from time to time. Usually closer to Mondays as I have a regular Monday night game, just about fifth lvl now and have only run Sellswords of Punjar and Dragora's Dungeon (our group is based in Punjar and I love the Lankhmar feel, especially now that I have Felis and huntin' for Whisker, Grey Mouser!). I think I do plan to head to the Beer and Pizza night this evening around seven pm. You in the hood here?


Heh, our game night is also Monday. ;) I actually live on the west side of Portland, near Beaverton, so my local flgs is Rainy Day Games in Aloha. Guardian Games is the coolest place in Portland though, for sure. Yeah Sellswords was awesome, I'm getting ready to run Scions pretty soon here and we just played Forgotten Temple yesterday to review it for our blog.

We should definitely get a DCC game together outside of our usual groups, get another gaming group together or something.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:24 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

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One of my FLGS put it in a pull file for me.

Woot!


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2009 9:06 am 
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Could I put in a request for Level Up? I'd like to see a regular column on House Rules. We've been putting together a list for our own group, but I'd love to see some additional content that I could incorporate. To give you an idea, these are items on our list (we're still fleshing it out):

Skills - beefing up the skills. I miss having more skills that help define a character. We're adding gem appraisal, art appraisal, professions (tanning, weaponsmithing, armor repair), etc.

Rituals - adding Identify back into the mix

Critical Hits / Bloodied - adding more conditional rules for being bloodied, critical hit charts (imagine a PCs left arm going limp after a critical hit), healing skill changes (after a PC drops to bloodied, they can only use healing surges up to bloodied, and require a healing skill / setting and bandaging a wound to heal back to full), etc.

Creature Rituals - we're adding back some of the abilities that creatures once had. Here is an example - black dragons. Control Reptiles and Corrupt Water are being thrown back in as creature rituals.

Anyway, I think a column on house rules would be fantastic.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2009 12:35 pm 
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Cold-Hearted Immortal

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Fat,

These are awesome ideas. I think you should email Aeryn and write him an article. :)

//H

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:05 pm 
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Cold-Blooded Diabolist
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Harley Stroh wrote:
These are awesome ideas. I think you should email Aeryn and write him an article. :)


Ha. :) Well...we are committing some house rules to paper this week...so I suppose that I could send some along for Aeryn to peruse.

I'll leave the creature rituals to N'Haaz-aua, since it was his suggestion (we had a brief "house rules" discussion a few weeks ago). I just found myself missing the atmosphere that was created by some of those powers and abilities that were removed (like the black dragon example).

I was just tossing the idea out there, because it's something that I'd love to see more of. I always like extra crunch that I can add to my home game.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:08 am 
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In general, thinking about the 4e economy, especially ritual and alchemy cost, gives me a migraine. That's the last of the simulationist in me.

I really like adding Identify back into the mix. I think I'll add that to my game soon.

As far as Critical Hits / Bloodied, I think this really slows the game down. There are a lot of creatures that key off bloodied that will make them pay for getting that low. Plus, max damage is bad! Might I suggest examining 3.0 d20 modern's hp rules? Its similar to yours and interesting.

I think Creature Rituals is huge. So much so I bet we could crank out a chapter in the rituals book in no time. I always think about consume likeness in Call of Cthulhu, but there are dozens of non combat, plot enhancing rituals that need to be added back in.

Our house rules are a mash of Jay Little's (Ynnen, who did a lot of Goodman stuff previously), Stephanie Huffaker's (DCC tourney judge and Goodman playtester), and my rules. They include social contracts which have had a lot of discussion on the blogs as well as gameplay tweaks. I'd be happy to share for an article or if anyone cares.

Our critical rules are as follows:
o If you make an attack roll of natural 20 you hit automatically and you score a critical hit.
o Exceeding the targets defense by 20+ is an automatic critical.
o Whenever you make an attack roll of natural 1, you grant combat advantage to all attackers (save ends) as an immediate reaction until the start of your next turn. You can take no further actions in this turn. Fumbles from close and burst attacks grant a +5 on this saving throw.
o Some critically failed skill checks in combat (like athletics) might be treated as critical failures in attacking and be subject to combat advantage as the situation arises.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:08 am 
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Tight-Lipped Warlock
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fathead wrote:
Rituals - adding Identify back into the mix


No offense, but...really?

You realize that the characters just auto-ID magic items by "spending time in the item's awesome pwn-ness," correct? Simply by the process of handling the item, the character can figure out it's properties.

I'm genuinely curious--not trying to be snarky--why you'd want to add a ritual that not only wastes a bit of game time but also seems redundant?

/thread derailment

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Please, call me Master Jenks while we're in the Sign of the Three Rats flophouse.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:44 am 
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No identify means that you can't have cursed items. It means you cannot add items with secret unlocakble powers easily. You cant add evil intelligent items. The list goes on. Mostly plot points. I agree, from a gameflow standpoint the RAW is better, but from a story and roleplaying standpoint, identify is better.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:31 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:27 pm
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Location: Portland, OR.
I agree with both above topics. Through my years of gaming, I have yet to really ever play in a campaign w/ more than four people, and often just three (sometimes two) so Identify has often been a pain at times. Too often we've been in the middle of a dungeon, cave, wilderness, ect and had to wait until we got to civilization to figure out what that damned item was (leather armor, dagger, backpack, girdle, whatever) for fear of it being a cursed item. They rarely are, but you always know that the ONE time you put something on/use it before casting identify, you're S.O.L. I do love that aspect at times though.. but currently in a game w/ four players and no magic users.. this new rule is handy at times.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:39 pm 
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I think I will be implementing a combination of the two: You can learn about an items primary power by studying it, but some items do not show as magical, some have secondary powers that only are revealed through ritual or use, and some have masked powers that can only be revealed by a ritual.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:34 pm 
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Cold-Blooded Diabolist
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N'Haaz-aua wrote:
I think I will be implementing a combination of the two: You can learn about an items primary power by studying it, but some items do not show as magical, some have secondary powers that only are revealed through ritual or use, and some have masked powers that can only be revealed by a ritual.


That was what I had in mind as well. Additionally, I had wanted some powers/histories only to be revealed through a combination of an identify ritual and skills - perhaps identify and a knowledge check. I haven't fleshed it out yet...I just know that I don't want to automatically hand out item powers and gem values as if they were playing a video game (Diablo comes to mind).

Arturu the Fighter - "Perhaps we should consult a sage regarding this odd item"

*hefts an obsidian orb*

Bumblefoot the Thief - "We don't need a sage anymore! Let me see it. Yeah, that's the legendary orb of obliteration! You'd better set that down...don't want to hurt anyone."

Arturu the Fighter - "What about this red gem that is the size of my fist...I wonder how much it is worth...maybe we should get it appraised by a gem merchant...ugh, I hate getting charged by those guys"

Bumblefoot the Thief - "Ha ha ha. We don't do that anymore."

*squints at it*

Bumblefoot the Thief - "Yeah...it's a ruby worth 8,900 nobles."

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:43 pm 
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Cold-Blooded Diabolist
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Ogrepuppy wrote:
fathead wrote:
Rituals - adding Identify back into the mix


No offense, but...really?

You realize that the characters just auto-ID magic items by "spending time in the item's awesome pwn-ness," correct? Simply by the process of handling the item, the character can figure out it's properties.

I'm genuinely curious--not trying to be snarky--why you'd want to add a ritual that not only wastes a bit of game time but also seems redundant?


What N'Haaz-aua said! ;)

Not every group would want to incorporate house rules like that. If you'd rather bypass appraising gems and identifying magic items in favor of a fast-moving epic, that's certainly acceptable. I don't feel that it slows down the game any though. I like my games to be a little more gritty and mysterious...and I'm trying to add that back in. Will I make Identify the same as it was in 3.5? Nah. I house-ruled that one too.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:47 pm 
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N'Haaz-aua,

You have me thinking now...

What if, on special magic items, we could have a skill challenge required to identify it properly? Whatcha think?

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 4:32 pm 
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Hafta admit, that is the great thing about house rules: I don't have to get your chocolate in my peanet butter if I don't want it. ;) (And vise-versa.)

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Enigma-Judge Narzill Tanntos (armorer Cleric of Amun Tor 4); Strength 15; Agility 10; Stamina 14; Personality 14; Intelligence 8; Luck 16; Neutral; AC 16 (banded mail); HP 24; missing three fingers from left hand.

Please, call me Master Jenks while we're in the Sign of the Three Rats flophouse.

"Will somebody please call all the ambulances?"


Last edited by Ogrepuppy on Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 5:07 pm 
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fathead wrote:
What if, on special magic items, we could have a skill challenge required to identify it properly? Whatcha think?


That's a great use of skill challenge, IMO.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:05 pm 
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Quote:
That's a great use of skill challenge, IMO.


Yes, yes it is.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 12:44 am 
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Cold-Blooded Diabolist

Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 8:50 pm
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I was finally able to stop at my distant LGS to ask about "Level Up!". He said he already has an order placed and I added it to my pull list.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:18 am 
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Player's Handbook has a small section on identifying magic items: while you can normally identify one magic item per short rest, the DM is well within her rights to require an Arcana check or specific quest to figure it out, and it calls out cursed items and artifacts.

You could extent this farther to require a Skill Challenge, with the obvious skills coming to mind Arcana, History, and Religion. Maybe rolling in Insight or Perception to notice minute things. Heck, if its an intelligent item you could add social skills to the mix.

You could also rule that a cursed item has effects upon being picked up, so they cant just drop it once they figure out its cursed. I remember more than a few items in 3rd Edition that snagged you upon pickup.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:59 pm 
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Location: San Jose, CA
For those of you interested in Level Up, make sure you check out our special offer for Worldwide D&D Game Day this Saturday the 21st! You can preorder at your local game (only $1.99!) and get entered in a contest to win your own private Free RPG Day!

More info at: http://www.goodman-games.com/WWDDD3-21.html

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:26 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

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Location: Portland, OR.
I'm excited about that offer, especially since I've already pre-ordered my copy of Level Up through my local shop. I'll be there on Saturday to geek out on the new chance to play paragon PHB2 classes, so I'll fill out a form and have em toss it your way. Thanks for givin' us gamers one more excuse to realize you guys are darned amazing!

Derek


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:35 pm 
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Full details at http://www.goodman-games.com/pr03-18-09.html ...

GOODMAN GAMES AND RPGNOW TO PROVIDE E-BOOK EDITION TO ALL PRINT PURCHASERS OF LEVEL UP

March, 18 – Goodman Games is pleased to announce that it has partnered with RPGNow to provide an innovative new service to purchasers of its new 4E print magazine Level Up. Every physical copy of Level Up will include a code that allows the buyer to download a free e-book edition from RPGNow. This code functions whether the purchase is made online, in a retail store, or via subscription. In effect, every print purchase includes the PDF version for free, regardless of where it’s purchased.

While other publishers have offered similar service exclusively to online purchasers or subscribers, Goodman Games is the first RPG publisher to offer a level playing field to bricks-and-mortar retailers. Combined with the unique pricing structure for Level Up, customers have a strong reason to visit their local game store: they can choose to pay $1.99 for both print and PDF editions at their favorite game store, or pay $4.00 online.

“Our net-savvy customers have repeatedly requested that we provide a PDF option with subscriptions,” said Joseph Goodman, President of Goodman Games. “I am glad to be able to do that, while also offering a PDF option for all other purchasers as well. This fair approach also introduces print customers to the world of PDF products, providing a new profit stream for both Goodman Games and bricks-and-mortar retailers who take advantage of RPGNow’s custom storefronts.”

RPGNow and its partner site, DriveThruRPG, are divisions of OneBookShelf, Inc., the industry’s largest source of PDF e-books. “We're very excited to be a part of this new program,” said Sean Patrick Fannon, RPG Marketing Manager of OneBookShelf. “This is a great way for us to support Goodman Games, one of our top publishers, as well as all of the Goodman customers and the hobby overall. We're also happy, of course, to get new customers coming to the sites to see all that we offer. This is an excellent proof-of-concept to show how e-books and download product can be effectively partnered with print media.”

For 2009, Level Up is the only Goodman Games product line to incorporate download codes. RPGNow and Goodman Games will work together on Level Up to refine the technology required to ensure easy downloads with minimal piracy. Provided the experiment is successful, Goodman Games expects to transition a broader portion of its product line to this dual print-and-PDF approach for 2010.

Bricks-and-mortar retailers can take advantage of this technology in new ways. First, they can now offer their Goodman Games customers the same download opportunities that other publishers only offer online. Second, they can work with RPGNow to create a custom retailer store front, and profit from their print customers’ purchases of PDFs.

Goodman Games is a publisher of role playing games, adventures, and accessories that celebrates its eighth anniversary this year. It is best known for its Dungeon Crawl Classics line of adventure modules, the longest-lived and most popular adventure product on the market. For more information, visit http://www.goodman-games.com.

RPGNow is a world-leading source of RPG e-books and other RPG products available with a simple mouse-click. To see all that RPGNow has to offer, simply visit http://www.rpgnow.com. Publishers and other business inquiries should be directed to Sean Patrick Fannon at sean@onebookshelf.com.

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:56 pm 
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Cold-Blooded Diabolist

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This is awesome news Joe, and I am glad to see you be the one to lead the way!

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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:13 am 
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Very nice plan.


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 Post subject: Re: Level Up
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:55 pm 
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This PDF plan is much appreciated!

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Please, call me Master Jenks while we're in the Sign of the Three Rats flophouse.

"Will somebody please call all the ambulances?"


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