Hi guys,
A lot of questions here, so I'll just start at the top and go through them...
Anonymous wrote:i have a few questions regarding mechs and incorporated steam powers. if i was a mech-devil and wanted to fight unarmed, had a coglayer lackey and had him incorporate a boiler into my mech engine would it mean 1) all physical properties of mech double aka str 30 = 60, speed doubles, etc? 2) all physical bonuses are doubled aka +10 str mod = +20 or 3) damage from physical attacks goes up 1 die ala amplifier?
First, I have to note that steam powers are weird. None of the other normal aspects of d20 work like steam powers. I did that intentionally, as I wanted them to feel different than spells. A coglayer with a "4th level steam power" would just feel like a tweaked wizard. But the consequence is a lot of the rules interaction is subtle and not always obvious. So I apologize for the confusion.
As a preface to your question, please note two points:
1. DragonMech, page 81, third column, under "Steam Powers": "Remember the mech's size. Fitting steam powers to large weapons or objects may require stacking them to reach the right dimensions." Basically, to affect a Large mech, you need a Large boiler. I thought I mentioned this more explicitly elsewhere in the manuscript, but the above quote is the best I can find at the moment.
2. Note the Monster Manual rules for doubling a creature's size, and the resulting effect on Strength (Monster Manual, page 291). I based the mech creation rules on the monster creation rules. The bonuses cap at +8, so if you were to create a boiler large enough to effect a mech, "doubling" the mech's strength would be equivalent (in rules mechanics) to doubling its size, which results in a Str bonus of +2 to +8 depending on the mech's starting size (per the table on MM p. 291).
If a player in my campaign tried to apply a boiler to his mech engine, I'd rule the following:
1. The boiler had to be an equivalent size to the mech. For example, he'd need a Colossal boiler to be strong enough to affect a Colossal mech. A Medium boiler takes 1 steam power, so a Large one takes 2, a Huge one takes 4, a Gargantuan one takes 8, and a Colossal one takes 16. Thus, this requires a fairly high-level coglayer.
2. The effect on the mech's Strength would be the equivalent of "doubling" its effective Strength as if its size had been doubled, baselined against the effect of doubling a monster's size, which results in a +8 bonus to Strength.
Does that help?
anonymous wrote:next, could i enchant my mech to be say +3 armor and how would that effect stats? particularly hardness and hp? also would the bonus only be armor or also effect unarmed attacks?
This is specifically addressed in the Mech Manual, scheduled for November release. Here's an excerpt:
Enchanted Mechs
It is possible to enchant an entire mech the way one enchants a sword or shield. The cost is steep, but the result is a mech with all the enhancement bonuses of both a magical weapon and magical armor (a +2 mech, for example). It is more accurate and deadly in melee, it resists damage, and it can strike creatures that are immune to mundane weapons.
Specifically, an enchanted mech gets its enhancement bonus to attack and damage when attacking without a weapon. Its AC and hardness are both improved by the amount of the enhancement bonus. The mech itself is considered to have its enhancement bonus for the purpose of overcoming damage resistance and similar abilities.
Creating a +2 mech is not unlike making a magic sword. The difference is scale. While a weaponsmith might only need a yard of true steel, the mechsmith needs tons of raw materials, all of it of the finest quality. Every step of the process must be carried out exactly right, meaning that extra oversight is needed. And regardless of the mech’s power source, its creation has many of the same steps needed to make an animated mech (pre-existing mechs cannot be enchanted).
As a result, enchanted mechs are hard to find. Many groups would rather put their resources into making a half-dozen conventional mechs that can serve adequately in the face of mundane threats. But the handful of enchanted mechs in service across Highpoint have uniformly distinguished records against even the toughest foes, and mech designers have begun sharing the secrets of these elaborate constructs.
Preparation is the key to making an enchanted mech. The Mechcraft DC is increased by +5, reflecting the extra care that must be taken, and the labor time is doubled. Moreover, creating an enchantment-quality mech takes twice as many overseers as usual. Mindless laborers, like undead and constructs, are not capable of assisting on work this detailed.
Not only does this labor raise the mech’s cost and slow its construction, the enchantment process adds time and expense. An extra set of rituals must be performed once construction is complete. This ritual time is determined by the mech’s size, using the chart for constructing animated mechs; these rituals are independent of any needed to create an animated or undead mech.
Cost, however, is the most jarring factor. First, an enchanted mech’s materials cost 10 times as much gold as an ordinary mech (no extra corpses are needed for an undead mech). This raises the base cost, which can have an affect on improvements down the line. Enchanting a mech also involves a fixed extra cost covering special parts, unusual materials, and any necessary research. This is added in after the base cost is calculated.
This fixed cost is based on two factors: the enhancement bonus provided, and the size of the mech. As with other magic items, the bonus can only go to +5. The costs indicated are for a Large mech. This amount doubles for every increase in size increment (so a Colossal mech requires 8 times the amount below).
+1 = 75,000 gp
+2 = 300,000 gp
+3 = 750,000 gp
+4 = 1,250,000 gp
+5 = 2,000,000 gp
As with any magic armament, the creator must also spend 1/25 the mech’s total cost in XP. This excludes the cost of any weapons or other accessories, as they are not enchanted with the rest of the mech. Fortunately for the mech designer, others can contribute XP to this cause. When the final rituals are performed, as many individuals as qualify can share in the XP cost, dividing it equally among themselves. These individuals must all have been participating in the entire building process, and must have the Combine Spell feat.
Anything that takes PU from the mech is considered a separate item for the purpose of this enchantment, whereas traits are covered by it. For instance, a +1 mech with combat spikes and a battleaxe in place of its arm gets a +1 to attack and damage with its spikes, but still doesn’t get the +1 bonus with the battleaxe. Exceptions may exist, but they are rare and entirely at the GM’s discretion.
An animated mech with an enhancement bonus cannot have magic immunity. The enhancement bonus is affected by dispel magic just as any other magic item, but the dispel must be capable of affecting the entire mech via the Combine Spell feat or similar means. So far nobody has figured out how to create an enchanted mech that has other weaponlike traits – the magic permeates the entire construct, so a flaming mech would have fiery doors, floors, and control panels. Other spell-like abilities can still be embedded in the mech at their normal cost.
Strong transmutation; CL 20; Craft Arms and Armor, Craft Magical Mech, magic weapon or magic fang.
Anonymous wrote:also, mech sizing steam powers wasn't worded too well (or i just don't comprehend too well
), do i take it that they go up by the appropiate size number, ex. animator is small for medium creature, would be huge for colosal mech?
I'll take the hit; they weren't worded well.
We actually had a lot of this come up in playtesting the Shardsfall Quest but at that point it was too late to change the core book's manuscript so que sera, que sera. I have to admit that there's something of a contradiction in the rules ... the table on page 55 came about when one of the playtesters complained that his halfling coglayer was carrying around too heavy of a load. But that table also states that a Gargantuan-sized steam power can be built at additional cost seemingly without taking up any extra steam power slots. (As I mentioned above, generally I required doubling of steam power slots to build steam powers that affected ever-larger targets.) Here's the way to read it. The table on page 55 is for sizing a steam power without increasing its power output or general effectiveness. For example, a pilot light needs a much bigger handle for a giant to use it than if a halfling used it. This requires more raw materials, takes longer to build, etc. But the power output remains the same. Only by expending an extra steam power does the power output also increase. A giant coglayer could spend 1 steam power on a Gargantuan boiler (costing x3 gp and weighing x4 lbs) but he still would have to expend 8 steam power slots for that Gargantuan boiler to actually affect a Gargantuan mech (and, since he built it larger, the Gargantuan boiler built by a giant off a
baseline size of Gargantuan would actually be size Colossal III and still cost x3 and weigh x4).
Umm... does that make sense?
Anonymous wrote:also the mech with a magi-missle wand, how's that work, the mech can't cast it, does the mech jockey? same for rodwalker, does every elf have 1 level of wizzy and somehow translate that through their mech or does it "just work"?
Early on it "just worked" but later on we started requiring a level of wizard or Use Magic Device. It's up to you. One thing I'd do differently, if I had to do it over again, is give elven mech jockeys some sort of quasi-mage ability to use magic items, and perhaps give all mech jockeys the class skill of Use Magic Device.
The Mech Manual also includes a new magic item that addresses this concern for some of its mechs -- basically a "casting device" that lets anyone use a magic item.
Anonymous wrote:the mech building section mentions being able to make mechs with greater stats but that sometimes doesn't work out right, the phys abilities is fine but better saves you usually go down size not up, and also was said you could build more manueverable mechs but doesn't say how. Also i think the price for building an adamantine armored mech is low but i won't complain
Hmmm... yeah, maybe that adamantine mech is too cheap.
The details on more maneuverable mechs are indeed omitted. I treat a change in maneuverability class as one full incremental improvement, per the sidebar on page 84.
Let me know if I missed again. I'll slowly get to all these questions...[/i]
the filter just came to me )
i guess i'll just borrow yours....but dammit don't you dare steal my jump-boots or transformer powers (to be posted eventually???)!!!!!!! lolol Also, nobody has yet answered the question of proper die advancement
