Goodman Games

Sword Guy wrote:That's a good point for the rotation. I was forgetting some of the mech rules and the rules for flying creatures. Guess I need to reread all of my books again. I shouldn't miss something as big as that.

I've never really done mech combat much before. Most of my PCs have been focused on not dying, and thus not getting into fights. Haven't played with anyone gung-ho enough to actually build a mech specifically for mech-based combat. Then again, I haven't played with anyone who's gung-ho about anything in the DragonMech setting.

As for constructs (which is what an animated object is), they gain 60 ft. darkvision and low-light vision. A columnist on the WotC D&D site said that it makes sense for constructs to be assumed to see as well as a normal human. Of course, all constructs are creatures, and the mech rules probably don't apply to them, so I don't know how facing rules would apply.

To add a new question to the mix, how fast does an extender work? It doesn't say how long it takes for an extender to affect an object. I'm working on a concept that kind of needs to know that.

Still can't believe I blanked on that big of a rule . . .

Well, constructs such as animated objects include any object effected by the animate object spell, such as chairs, candle sticks, and what not, so I would say that anything that can be applied to them could apply to a magically animated mech. Since many objects that might be animated have no obvious means of seeing, one might assume that such an object can see in any direction it wants to. Now, as to whether or not it should be able to look in a direction that it is not facing, I think that it should be allowed to in the same way that a similarly animated object with no obvious means of sensory perception would be able to see in any direction.

Okay, now that the issue with awakened mechs has been mostly resolved, can anyone tell me about the extender? It gives no time for it to work in Steam Warriors, but the folder in the core book says that a folder takes 1d6 rounds to fold or unfold an object.

Sword Guy wrote:Okay, now that the issue with awakened mechs has been mostly resolved, can anyone tell me about the extender? It gives no time for it to work in Steam Warriors, but the folder in the core book says that a folder takes 1d6 rounds to fold or unfold an object.

The extender isn't quite the opposite of the folder. The extender seems to be intended to use on smaller objects, so 1d6 rounds seems a bit much. I'd say a full-round action per 10' of extension? Like most of my answers, I just made that up but it seems reasonable to me.

Just got 2nd Age of Walkers and I was wondering if ther was a specific formula you were using for magic items used on mech to determine cost, XP, and PU. I noticed the 2 rings built into Tanniel and wanted to know about doing similar things for my designs (I'm thinking of maybe Boots of Striding and Springing for a scout mech).

Double Post.

Raptor wrote:Just got 2nd Age of Walkers and I was wondering if ther was a specific formula you were using for magic items used on mech to determine cost, XP, and PU. I noticed the 2 rings built into Tanniel and wanted to know about doing similar things for my designs (I'm thinking of maybe Boots of Striding and Springing for a scout mech).

Excellent idea for a scout mech -- although I imagine some coglayer somewhere is cobbbling together Murgatroyd's Mega-Speed Gear Relays to prove the primacy of steam over spells. Anyway, I built Tannanliel, and since it was a huge and unique mech I left the underlying magic-item math to GM's discretion. From a broader standpoint, here's my thinking...

Magic items for a mech are like magic items for a person, only much larger. This means they cost more; if you're designing an item for a Gargantuan mech, look at the cost for a normal longsword and compare it to the cost of a Gargantuan blade. Whatever that cost multiplier is, it applies to your new item.

PU use is again based on what it would be for a person. If it's an item that takes up more space than clothing/jewelry on a human body, it takes up PU on the mech. How many PU? Depends on the size of the item and of the mech size(s) it's intended for. We've scattered a few of these among the books.

XP cost is something I base on size. To be frank, I've never had PCs design magic items for a mech, so I haven't got a hard-and-fast rule on it. My preference is to assume that every increase of size doubles the amount of XP required, but that multiple builders can use the Combine Spell feat to jointly contribute XP.

How's that work for you?

walrusjester wrote: XP cost is something I base on size. To be frank, I've never had PCs design magic items for a mech, so I haven't got a hard-and-fast rule on it. My preference is to assume that every increase of size doubles the amount of XP required, but that multiple builders can use the Combine Spell feat to jointly contribute XP.

How's that work for you?

Hey, that sounds good to me. But I've never tried to make magic items for a mech.

Do Mechs count as construct for the purposes of effects such as ranger favored enemies and Bane weapons? Do undead mechs do count as undead?

Raptor wrote:Do Mechs count as construct for the purposes of effects such as ranger favored enemies and Bane weapons? Do undead mechs do count as undead?

My personal inclination is to say "no" and "yes" to your questions, but that seems kind of inconsistent. Mostly I think that because mechs and other constructs are so common on Highpoint that I wouldn't feel it to be particularly unfair to make a ranger specify "mechs" or "non-mech constructs" when choosing a favored enemy, but undead mechs are quite rare so it would be a bit silly to make things that only effect undead mechs.

From a purely logical standpoint, though, I'd go with "yes" and "yes".

If that helps at all...

Okay, then in that spirit: What's the effect of Favored Enemy on constructs made from organic steel or necrotic steel? Does Favored Enemy (undead) work on undead-constructs? Does Favored Enemy (construct)? Or, since it's a completely new type, do you have to get a completely new Favored Enemy for it?

Raptor wrote:Do Mechs count as construct for the purposes of effects such as ranger favored enemies and Bane weapons? Do undead mechs do count as undead?

I'd say yes to both. As a house rule, I might follow up on Mythfish's notion of creating a "mech" type for favored enemies, or even splitting it further to reflect the different vulnerabilities of steam-driven and magic-driven mechs. It also depends on how common you want mechs to be in your games. DragonMech deliberately doesn't specify just how common mechs are, since we want to support a variety of play styles within the same setting. So if your PCs run into mechs in every combat or two, there should be a separte "Mech" category for favored enemies and bane weapons. If they only fight mechs at key points of a campaign, the "Construct" category ought to do it.

Sword Guy wrote:Okay, then in that spirit: What's the effect of Favored Enemy on constructs made from organic steel or necrotic steel? Does Favored Enemy (undead) work on undead-constructs? Does Favored Enemy (construct)? Or, since it's a completely new type, do you have to get a completely new Favored Enemy for it?

I wouldn't require a new type of Favored Enemy just because the mech is made of an unusual substance. My books aren't handy, so I can't recall all the effects of organic/necrotic steel, but I don't believe they cause a fundamental change in the way the mech moves and operates, and that to me is what really determines a mech's type.

Don't forget that enemies can fall into multiple catagories for the purposes of a ranger using his favored enemy ability.

I would count an undead mech as both a construct and an undead, and a ranger with either as a favored enemy would therefore recieve a favored enemy bonus.

Note, also, that the bonus does not stack; it's a case of use the best bonus that is applicable, where the enemy falls into multiple catagories.

Personally, I would give mechs thier own catagory, except as follows: undead mechs would be undead as well, and magically animated mechs would be considered constructs (either in addition to or as opposed to being of the mech type). My reasoning being that the three mechanical varieties are very similar to each other outside of the engine construction, whereas the other two types don't have the intricate workings that make a mech vulnerable to critical hits.

Got it. I was mainly asking because for Favored Enemy, you have to choose a creature type. Undead-construct and plant-construct are completely new creature types, and not templates. I agree that if you're able to choose "mech" as a creature type, or even specific kinds of mechs, then it makes sense that you'd still get the bonus against mechs made of different materials.

My question was more geared towards people not facing mechs with the new creature types, but creatures instead. For example, if I made a mechanical creature (like a cogling crawler) out of necrotic or organic steel, what would be the required Favored Enemy rules against it? It's still a construct, so Favored Enemy (construct) might work, but it's not fully a construct any more. In the same vein, Favored Enemy (undead) could be argued to work against undead-constructs, but it's not fully undead any more.

Should the character be required to get Favored Enemy (undead-construct) or Favored Enemy (plant-construct) to fight these creatures? I know that there haven't been any monsters published that use these rules, so right now the question's more of scholarly curiosity than of necessity. But I'd still like to know.

Posted shortly after Reese. Oops.

Really? Could you point me to the rule that says an enemy can fall into multiple categories? Haven't seen it around, but I have no doubt that it exists. I've learned to trust the rules knowledge of the people on this board.

page 47, last column, right over the table of potential favored enemy types. it's the alst paragraph in the ability description in the PHB

Ah, right. I need to memorize the PHB, so I can stop asking all these questions that I should know. Sorry for taking up extra time from people.

Nah, you just need to remember to look up abilities when you debate about them. I always do it when I can because I know my memory is bad.

HI ya so I have tryed buying you books at quite a few stores lately (quite a few of them had the original dragonmech hand book mind you) however none of them cared any others so at all of the places that I tryed out I asked them to pleas order the books that I wanted for me (they were the mech manual and steam worriors) and on each occasion I got one of two answers ether, "Oh I'm sorry but we had troble with that distributer and we dont deal with them any more." or they would try to order the book and in a few weeks they would tell me that they had troble with the destributer and could not get the book for me, and on one occasion where I know the people Who own the store I am pritty sure that they actually tryed sending the order therew multipule times and got ether no respons or nothing worth telling me about. so I gess my question would be WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON, and my folow up to that questin would be can I get the dragon mech bookes any more or not, finally what about threw stores and if not why not?

HI ya so I have tryed buying you books at quite a few stores lately (quite a few of them had the original dragonmech hand book mind you) however none of them cared any others so at all of the places that I tryed out I asked them to pleas order the books that I wanted for me (they were the mech manual and steam worriors) and on each occasion I got one of two answers ether, "Oh I'm sorry but we had troble with that distributer and we dont deal with them any more." or they would try to order the book and in a few weeks they would tell me that they had troble with the destributer and could not get the book for me, and on one occasion where I know the people Who own the store I am pritty sure that they actually tryed sending the order therew multipule times and got ether no respons or nothing worth telling me about. so I gess my question would be WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON, and my folow up to that questin would be can I get the dragon mech bookes any more or not, finally what about threw stores and if not why not?

Try Paizo.com Gnomentinker, they have most of the books. Now for my question. I was looking through the Irontooth section of my 2nd Age of Walkers and noticed that many of clans listed the Raptors and Magwagons among their mech inventories, but I have been unable to find their stats in any of the books. Does anybody know what book and page# they are?

Raptor wrote:Try Paizo.com Gnomentinker, they have most of the books. Now for my question. I was looking through the Irontooth section of my 2nd Age of Walkers and noticed that many of clans listed the Raptors and Magwagons among their mech inventories, but I have been unable to find their stats in any of the books. Does anybody know what book and page# they are?

Those are both from The Shardsfall Quest, on pages 58-59.

The Lunar Skinstealer's host domination acts as the dominate person spell. Dominate person only works on humanoids. Obviously the Skinstealer can do more than humanoid given the Dronog example. Should it work on all creature types like dominate monster, humanoids plus aberrations, humanoids plus lunar, or some other combination? What about neighbor domination? Does it work on the same types?

dulsi wrote:The Lunar Skinstealer's host domination acts as the dominate person spell. Dominate person only works on humanoids. Obviously the Skinstealer can do more than humanoid given the Dronog example. Should it work on all creature types like dominate monster, humanoids plus aberrations, humanoids plus lunar, or some other combination? What about neighbor domination? Does it work on the same types?

Anything with a mind that can be dominated, and with skin softer than stone, can be dominated by a lunar skinstealer (if the skinstealer is big enough). That includes humanoids, animals, some vermin, giants, fey, monstrous humanoids, most magical beasts, many aberrations, and some outsiders. Were there any particular monsters you wondered about?

walrusjester wrote:Anything with a mind that can be dominated, and with skin softer than stone, can be dominated by a lunar skinstealer (if the skinstealer is big enough). That includes humanoids, animals, some vermin, giants, fey, monstrous humanoids, most magical beasts, many aberrations, and some outsiders. Were there any particular monsters you wondered about?

Not really. Just thinking of what the skinstealer could use against the players. (Thinking of creating a lunar caterpillar creature for first mech combat and wondered if it could be sent by the skinstealer. More I think about it I think I'll leave it as just a creature they encounter. Wanted a non-mech with a low AC that they could take even if non proficient with mech weapons.)

Another question: A mech's fuel bins store 9 days worth of coal. Is that 9 days of 24 hour activity? Or 9 days of 8 hour activity? I assume it is the first so a mech could operator for 27 days assume it was only on for 8 hours a day.